Thursday, January 31, 2013

Statement Analysis of Joaquin Shadow Rams

Here is the blog entry of the father who now stands accused of purchasing life insurance against his toddler and drowning him.Joaquin Shadow Rams stands accused of killing his son for profit. It is not, however, his first contact with death. 

He is writing to deny the allegation.  Did he do it?
Statement Analysis gets to the truth. 

Will he issue a reliable denial?

Statement Analysis is in bold type with italics, underlining and color added for emphasis. He is writing to answer the accusation that he killed his own son after purchasing life insurance against him. 

Unwarranted Destruction of an Innocent Man

I am very devastated at not only the loss of my son, Prince, but also by the way I am being characterized as a demon, psychopath, or murderer by the media and in the myriad of blogs who have done nothing but speculate, without knowing any of the facts. 
Note that this is a perfect opportunity to tell us that he did not drown his son and let everyone know the facts. 
Up to this point, I have been counseled by my attorney not to comment to the media concerning this tragic death of my son who I fought for months in court just to see. I have honored his wishes.
We can now expect his attorney's wishes (plural) not to comment to the media to come to an end at "this point" where he writes.  Will he now say he did not drown his son?
From the beginning, starting with my son’s mother, Hera McLeod, forcibly removing him from our home on July 17, 2011, my attorney and I worked endlessly with the goal of trying to be a part of my son’s life. I jumped through a myriad of hoops for the Court and complied with EVERY requirement placed upon me by Judge Algeo, the presiding judge in this case. Judge Algeo is a fine man, and a fair judge who has also been pilloried in the media for simply taking the facts he was presented with, and making a ruling based on those facts. I had many requirements I had to comply with to Judge Algeo’s satisfaction before I was even allowed supervised visitation.
Instead of telling us he did not cause his son's death, he has taken to praise the judge as a "fine man" instead. 
That I did comply with all of the Judge Algeo’s requirements, as well as a very favorable report from the retired police officer present during the supervised visitations I was granted, was the basis for the Judge’s decision to grant unsupervised visitation. Again, his decisions were based on the facts presented to him only, not the rhetoric and unsubstantiated innuendos of Hera McLeod, Prince’s mother. Coincidently, the retired officer, Mrs. Diane Tillery was chosen by Prince’s mother to supervise my visits. In spite of that, I still received a favorable report, much to Hera’s dismay and displeasure.
Here he recognizes that the Judge did not have all the information when he made his decision.  
I was awarded two Saturdays per month for a total of 8 hours per visit, as well as every other Wednesday afternoon for three hours if my work schedule allowed for the visit to occur. In total, I got to see my son for less than 100 hours spread over several months after not seeing him for close to a year. His mother, Hera McLeod had Prince 99% of the time, THOUSANDS of hours, but she is not at fault at all?
The social introduction is very poor.  He used her name previously and should now go to the shorter use of it.  The re-introucing her this way is for emphasis.  
Some other “pertinent” FACTS of this story that have NOT been told…
The reason this whole thing could have started was due to a “fall” my son took onto the street while in his mother’s care shortly (less than a week) before I picked him up on September 8, 2012. When I picked Prince up at the safe exchange in Montgomery County as arranged by the Court that day, I immediately noticed that Prince had a significant cut on his forehead that had been closed with surgical strips in lieu of stitches. Mrs. Tillery, the same retired Police Officer chosen by Hera to handle the supervised visitation initially and was also ordered to supervise and facilitate Prince’s exchange where the parents have no direct contact during the exchange, told me that Prince had taken a “nasty fall” and cut his head, but he is “fine”. Later that day, I found out how “fine” he really was.
The words "fall" and "fine" are placed, by him, in italics.  This is to demonstrate disbelief. 
Prince had a seizure in my arms.
This is critical information for the investigators:  whatever happened to the child, the father's hands were upon him. 
I immediately called 911 and did everything they directed me to do until the EMTs arrived. I rode with him to Prince William Hospital and signed the approval to treat form as his father.
This indicates a delay in calling 911.  Who would delay calling 911 when a child has a seizure?  There is no reason to report "immediately" in an emergency.  
Prince was diagnosed as having a febrile seizure. This type of seizure experienced by Prince was HEREDITARY and was passed to him through Hera and her mother who BOTH also suffered seizures as a youth.
Here, he rebuts that the "nasty fall" was the cause, but hereditary; and he blames the maternal bloodline. 
He has yet to tell us he did not drown his son. 
According to, Hera’s blog, her post dated September 11, 2012 titled “The Danger of a Psychopathic Parent in a Medical Crisis”, she stated, “he has told us all about YOUR situation and he has done all the right things by taking the child to the hospital.”
Further on in the same post Hera wrote (the “Luc” mentioned is short for Lucifer, her “pet” name for me until she replaced it with “Killer” in later posts):
“Thankfully, by the grace of God, Luc was savvy enough to call 911 when he witnessed baby boy having a seizure; however, 911 was called an hour before I was ever notified that baby boy was having a medical crisis. Luc called 911, took the trip in the ambulance, arrived at the hospital, completed the medical examination questions and intake paperwork…”
Since Hera had refused to provide me with medical records of Prince, nor notify me of the potential for seizures, I was completely unaware and helpless when the first seizure Prince had in my custody happened on September 8, 2012. 
Other than the genetic information above
I was subsequently informed by the ER Doctor at Prince William Hospital that the front part of the brain is where most seizures originate. The fact that Prince had fallen on the front part of his head, onto the street, with a skull as soft as his was at his age could have been a contributing factor for the severity of what we were told was his first seizure. This little fact was completely ignored by most of the media, and in fact some versions state that I was the cause of the cut, not Hera, in whose care he was in at the time he fell.
He calls this a "little" fact.  We should believe him. What is it about the child's medical history that was so necessary to save him from drowning? 
Even the doctors at Prince William Hospital were crippled because I could not tell them anything about Prince’s medical history, and without it could only administer the most basic and general care. The doctors also told me AND Hera that if it wasn’t for my quick response that Prince could have gone into a coma or worse. To the doctor, the seizure seemed more severe than he would have anticipated as an “initial seizure”.
The doctor's testimony will be interesting. 
On September 8, 2012 Hera and her mother took Prince OUT of Prince William Hospital even though the doctors suggested that he remain overnight. Both Hera and her mother objected and took him out of Prince William Hospital anyway.

It is either "against medical advice" or not.  He has yet to deny the allegation of drowning the child and giving us the "facts"
What happened next?
Again, in Hera’s own words from the same blog post of September 11, 2012:
“Round Two – Post initial hospital visit”
“After being rushed through hospital discharge, I realized that something still appeared “off” with baby boy. He was still feverish and appeared to be struggling to walk. Though Luc didn’t notice this as odd behavior (or maybe didn’t really care), I noticed as I see baby boy on a daily basis and know what is normal for him. I was not satisfied with his treatment at the first hospital (as it was clear Luc had been running the show and lying to the staff), son I brought baby boy to a hospital closer to my house.
At first, I felt like maybe I was being a little paranoid but I couldn’t shake the feeling that something had been missed. Low and behold, about 30 minutes after baby boy was admitted into the second hospital, his fever spiked and he proceeded to have two more seizures. The hospital near my home indicated that the first hospital had been negligent in their care of baby boy as they had not ordered additional testing to identify the true cause of the seizures.”
Where was “I” in THIS series of events? Was “I” negligent or the “hospital”?
It sounds to me that from her own words that I was not involved in any negligence in anyway. And how could I be “running the show”? I stayed out of the way and let the doctors and nurses do their job.
But what about her?
She wrote that Prince appeared to be “struggling to walk”. She was letting him walk shortly after having a seizure? How negligent is that?
What medical history does he refer to?
Because of this helplessness concerning lack of Prince’s medical history, I subsequently requested Prince’s medical records from Hera through my attorney. She refused to provide them until she was threatened with a court appearance to explain to Judge Algeo why she refused to provide them. She relented, and I received a bare bones “summary” of Prince’s records and insurance information.
He answers:  insurance information.  This would not change a thing and is not the same as saying, "I did not cause my child's death"
According to the medical community, “ordinary” febrile seizures (which Prince suffered “initially” with me on September 8, 2012) are both hereditary and usually benign. However, more than one seizure in a 24 hour period is not considered an ordinary febrile seizure. They are then called “complex” seizures, and carry both a greater risk, and a higher degree of concern. Complex seizures could also be an indicator for epilepsy. Once seizures become “complex” seizures, ALL subsequent seizures, whether individually or in groups (such as what happened after my son Prince left Prince William Hospital on September 8, 2012) are complex seizures and should be treated as such. Whether Prince was ever tested for epilepsy, or prescribed anti-seizure medication, I do not know, nor was I ever given any medication to administer to Prince while he was in my care other than baby Tylenol for his frequent fevers, another trigger of seizures. He was a far cry from the “perfectly” healthy baby he was portrayed as by Hera to the media.
Did Hera tell the media reporting on this story that Prince had also had ANOTHER seizure the DAY BEFORE my last visitation? But they let him come anyway, assuring me through Mrs. Tillery, the exchange officer, AGAIN that he was “fine”, and that he also had another bruise on his head that both I and Mrs. Tillery noted at the time I picked him up? And WHO was negligent? Not I.
In fact, according to Hera’s post on her blog dated October 23, 2012, and titled“Rest in Peace Baby Boy”, the day before my last visit (and my son’s tragic death), Hera said that he had a seizure on the day before, and that she called the ambulance “per usual”. Per Usual? I do not know how many additional seizures he had while in her care, but she called the ambulance per usual? I have not been able to obtain Prince’s medical records from the hospital in Montgomery County where I assume he was also taken PER USUAL. I wonder why, wouldn’t you?
He does not tell us that the records do not exist; only that he was not able to obtain them. 
Here is her post, again in her own words:
8:30am Friday October 19th:
“Baby boy had been running a fever and the night before his fever had spiked again causing another seizure. I called the ambulance, per usual, and again was told that baby boy was fine and that Febrile Seizure are benign and that I should just take him into the doctors in the morning.”
Except these may not have been “ordinary” seizures. They could have been complex seizures that Hera’s “per usual” doctors could have missed as well. I am aware of 5 seizures Prince had. There were the three seizures on September 8, 2012, one on Friday October 19, 2012, and the one in my custody on October 20, 2012. Again, because of the number and frequency of these seizures, they were probably no longer simple, benign seizures. They were more likely complex seizures indicating a greater risk.
Later in the same post, again, her words:
Saturday October 20th: Morning
“…At that moment, I felt him a little warm and started to panic. I thought, ‘oh no…another fever…what if he has a seizure there.’ Then, I remembered the doctors words. I ran back to the Harris Teeter to get him some fever medication just so that I could be sure he wasn’t going to spike a fever. I then told the supervisor that I had created a log with medical information and noted the time I administered medication and told her it would be important for Luc to watch him to make sure he didn’t get another fever.”
I was told by Mrs. Tillery that he had just been given medication when I picked him up, in other words, around 10AM. Mrs. Tillery was late to the drop off and arrived around 10:20AM. Consequently, any further medication would not have been indicated until 4-6 hours later, in other words, 2PM at the earliest. Prince was still sleeping at 2PM, and his seizure (while sleeping) began shortly thereafter.
Since I have not gotten access to Prince’s medical records in Montgomery County from either the “per usual” hospital or I can also assume the “per usual” pediatrician, I can only speculate (if the media can do it, so can I) about how many additional seizures Prince had between September 8 and October 19, 2012. I would be very interested to know. Considering the other seizures came frequently and close together, how many seizures did he REALLY have while with his mother? I sure would like to know, how about you? Has Hera even been asked? If not, WHY NOT?
And out of the five seizures I am aware of, two were in my care and three were in Hera’s. And I am the only one negligent when I only got to see him every other Saturday and had limited access to any medical information, and she had him thousands of hours and was IN CHARGE of his primary medical care?
There are way too many “inconsistencies” concerning the facts in this case for the Post and others to write or produce such biased and poorly investigated articles castigating a man who fought to be a part of his son’s life. Much of the information I have outlined is PUBLIC RECORD! But did the Post and others do any “due diligence” before slamming me in the court of public opinion? Not in my book.
He refers to himself as "a man"
I should also like to point out that this is not the first time I have been accused of a crime by Hera and her family. The first time, I was not only completely exonerated, but testified at both Hera and her sister’s trials that resulted from their arrest for filing a false police report (the sister) and obstruction of justice (Hera). Again, this is public record. I however have a clean record. I am a devoted father, and far from the horrible person I have been made out to be in the media.
He does not tell us the crime; nor does he tell us that he didn't do it.  He only reports that he has a clean record. 
A quick point about my involvement concerning my mother, Alma R. Collins. My mother was suffering from early stages of Alzheimer’s. She left a two page suicide note found by the police clearly indicating why she chose to end her life as to not be “a burden” to her son. This note was retained by Prince William County Police as evidence. During this character assassination, Prince William County stepped up and denied that this was anything but a suicide and would not be reopening this case.
They should.  The subject uses "my involvement" which clearly tells us:  he was involved in his mother's suicide.  
A quick point about the death of my oldest son’s mother, Shawn K. Mason. As mentioned in the Post “editorial”, this case has been pending for almost 10 YEARS, with no evidence that I had ANY part in her death. At the time of the initial investigation, I FULLY cooperated, took several polygraphs, gave DNA, took a gun residue test and had a clear and documented alibi with numerous witnesses and video footage as to my whereabouts at the time of her death.
His ex, his mother, and his son are all dead from contact with him.  Here, he does not say he didn't do it, only that he "fully" cooperated, making his cooperation sensitive.  With his ex, his mother and now his son, he must be the most unlucky man on the planet.  What are the odds?
I would also like to take this opportunity to thank all of you who have expressed sorrow and concern over the loss of our son, whether to me or to Hera. I am deeply touched and forever grateful to those of you who do not believe the outrageous allegations made about me. I have received many wonderful emails on my Facebook account, and I wish to express my sincere appreciation for your support. God willing, the truth will come out, and I will be found as innocent of these allegations concerning my son Prince as I am of any of the other outrageous things I have been accused of and found innocent of in the past.
God Bless.
We should believe him. 
He does not say that he did not drown his son. 
We are not allowed to say it for him.  


Apple said...

He should keep writing.
There are a "myriad" of reasons he makes me want to vomit. Good luck with the other inmates.

S + K Mum said...

He didn't say he didn't drown his son - he doesn't even mention drowning - he also doesn't say anything about loving his son or missing him for the year he didn't have contact. He speaks of his son so matter-of-factly, like a car that is shared and there is arguements over who dented it, who was driving it when the gearbox failed etc.
I can't bear to think what may have happened to this boy at the hands of his father. I suspect he knew enough about the seizures when he was buying life insurance though. He mentions it so often - he clearly knew (or thinks) this would be his 'get out of jail free card'. Also hoping for a hot-shot defence lawyer to scare Law Enforcement. It happens after all!
I don't think the father is even blaming the mother, he is just saying; she did that, I did this, what's the difference? No denial of anything.
Another sick parent! One who thinks they are clever!

QChick said...

Interesting that the letter does not address the drowning and subsequent death of his son. This letter is about everything else except that. Maybe his lawyer specified that he could write the letter as long as he did not address the current allegations against him. I had trouble with the letter because this man's writing reminded me so much of how my father, who was emotionally abusive, wrote.

rob said...

What can any other possible reason be for insuring a 18 month old for $560,000?

Anonymous said...

Clipped from The Washington Post 1/28/12

During the court fight over custody and visitation, officials testified about Rams’s possible involvement in two other mysterious deaths. A Manassas police detective testified that Rams remained a suspect in the unsolved 2003 shooting death of a former girlfriend, Shawn Katrina Mason. Rams had an opportunity and motive to commit the crime, the detective testified. A Prince William social worker noted in a report that Rams mistakenly thought he was the beneficiary of Mason’s life insurance policy.

Police are also re-examining the apparent 2008 suicide of Rams’s mother.

The judge that allowed unsupervised visits should be removed from custody cases. JMHO

$560,000.00 in insurance policies on a baby?

Enough said!

BostonLady said...

Whoa. 3 family members are dead and this man is closely tied to them? Where there is smoke, there is fire. Did he collect insurance money from all 3 deaths?

The 2 previous deaths should be re-investigated. The fact that the case of his ex wife is still open after 10 years indicates they have not cleared him.

What I read in his post is "me , me , me" I hope he is finally made to face the consequences.

BostonLady said...

Sorry, I said ex wife, I meant ex girlfriend.

I am absolutely stunned that the amount of the life insurance is $560,000 !!! I missed that when I first read this. Can anyone just purchase a life insurance policy for any amount and it's not flagged? I thought seeing the $25 K for Baby Ayla was huge but this ?

His son was just a vehicle to get money. Cold, calculated, pre-meditated murder.

Lis said...

This is a man who is very manipulative and is used to manipulating. He uses flattery, changing subject, keeping focus off the incident in question, projecting blame, as someone who is used to using those tactics. As everyone has noticed, he has not said that he didn't do it. It is always amazing to me that a person so familiar with deception and manipulation still does not come out and lie directly.

I would like to know who the insurance agent was who sold him this policy and why they did not question it and investigate further, as they had a duty to. They played a large part in the child's death by giving him incentive to commit murder.

Jen said...

Hi BostonLady-

I'm thinking the same thing...3 people have met their demise under suspicious circumstances and the common denominator is this guy (and life insurance)! That's an enormous amount of life insurance to take out on a child and it should have raised red flags. Most insurance companies require proof of substantial income which stands to be lost in the event of death before issuing larger policies. This father was clearly BANKING on his sons premature death, the article states that he mistakenly believed himself to be the beneficiary of his dead ex's insurance policy and you can bet your bottom dollar he profited from his mothers passing...either by insurance or inheritance of her estate.

What a waste of life this 'man' is, existing only to inflict pain on others and greedily take whatever he wants, regardless of who he has to hurt to get it. This poor baby didn't have a chance with parents like these (why is mom online engaging in a blog war)? Like one of the above posters said, this guy writes about the death of his his if he's talking about a ruined car..(she drove it everyday, but the engine blew in the 8 hrs I was in the drivers seat...who's fault is that?)


Jen said...

Hi Lis-

My husband and I just went through the process of taking out life insurance and establishing our wills after the birth of our son and we had to provide proof of income and our policy was calculated on what would be needed to replace our income to provide for our family's current and future needs. I stay at home with our son so my policy was limited to covering final expenses and debts, husbands policy is larger as the main provider, but it was established and limited by the insurance company. So, I can't understand how in the world this guy legally obtained that much insurance on a toddler! Maybe he took out smaller policies from many sources(?) but if he did obtain that amount from one agent or company then I would count them as an accomplice in this premeditated murder!

Vita said...

Photos of Prince, links

He is so tiny, so precious. How could " anyone" purposefully hurt him.

The father his photos.

Don't judge a book by it's cover? the information of his past, his associations with others who up and died, no wonder this woman did not want her SON near him. The COURT failed Prince or ? The visitation order, was what? because of his sperm? he to be bio? his paternal rights outweighed Prince's welfare? or he was granted Prince by the domino affect? It does not matter how Prince was created or came into this world, what mattered was his safety, welfare once in this world.

He the donor to have a laundry list of red flags, records and yet this precious baby was court ordered to be with him unsupervised. Sounds to me that no one delved into this man's doings/history until it was too late. Or was it not this at all?

This little boy represents all the children who have been written about here, in the last two+ years. The ones who are not found especially, that are victims " not proven" of their own parents.

I have a part 2, my brain on fire, this to some maybe me on a soap box. No, it is my personal said for women to read, and not for me to sound perfect, not for me to wagging fingers no. I have had my own experiences with my daughters donor.

I thank god, I had one woman on my side in family court, that was able to sniff him out, she to guide me legally. Paternity established he to sue me, was all proven, she was his, he came after me, not me after him. She to guide me, that before my daughter was 13 mos old it was established I had full custody. He to sign off all his rights. He had only seen her that one time and that was the meeting of the papers, he not to read the documents, he signed away with a giggle. He then to stare at me, and say I am hungry, you got any money. People tell you who they are.

Even though I had known him for 15 yrs, she being a prosecutor, she could see him for who he was. That I could not see? I too close, lost all objectivity? or I was young and naive and believed that baby's were to bring people to their senses, bring out their best, create a warm fuzzy, everyone lives happily ever after even if living apart. I learned the harsh reality, thankfully I was able to prevent my daughter from becoming a victim, of yes, him.

Vita said...

We learn from our errors, we learn from others. The endless cases of child abuse, filicide by egg/sperm donor. There is a direct message here, in children's deaths, he Prince to be of countless precious victims. As a parent, the protecting parent, the parent holding the child, raising the child, choose your battles wisely. This is to all mothers, fathers that are in risk assessed relationships with a innocent baby in the middle.

TV, Maury Povich show a example. He to bring on countless people, for establishing Paternity. Women to present to the world, this man, she to scream he is the father of my baby, he won't acknowledge my son, my daughter. He is a trifling pos, he won't come around, doesn't buy diapers, yadda. He doesn't give me a dime. He has been in and out of jail, he is unemployed, the woman to go on and on. Guy sitting back stage, he to offer his side, blah blah. He to come on and everyone BOO's him.

Once next to each other it becomes a pissing match, yelling and screaming. Baby shown on the big screen, behind all, the innocent.
Did the woman truly hear her own words said of this MAN she claimed to be the father of her baby? He a creed not able to take care of a pet rock, and yet she is demanding him to be in her babies life. For the CHECK that will never come. 30.00 a month is not going to make your child's world a better place, sorry. He to face bench warrants, license suspensions, be dragged into court, he a broke ass.
Paternity established in a broken non conforming relationship - do not sell your child out for your personal discomforts. If you know this guy is a POS, the money child support ( he not able or able to provide) $ should never be the bottom line. Your babies welfare is the bottom line. You cannot put a price tag on your childs head, welfare. LET him GO. DO not go after him, he is NOT worthy, his proven is in your face.

The second he is put into the corner, court ordered, his character to be S*it, records to prove it, people to witness his lack of, you to know who he is. Is you as mother " Rolling the Dice" with your babies welfare by engaging the court after him.

YOU now have given him equal power, authority over your baby. He can take him/ her, and have a judge grant visitation right before your own eyes. You to say he is this that and the other every time he pisses you off, this of the baby or indirect of, personal to you. Informing the court of his every lackey move, this is not in your best interest. The court recording documenting, is by you, your own doing, diluting your power as Mother. Crying wolf, then when something SERIOUS happens, the court is DEAF. The court is not paid to be psychologists. What happened? you must chose your battles wisely. He owes you nothing, he owes his child not you. If he is not willing, and is doing everything in his power to avoid his child, you,..look at this as a gift.

He not being a participant, take that into consideration, that possibly this is " Your Godsend" that he is not around, as he knows who he is, he doesn't trust himself, to be with his own baby.

Don't become the antagonist in the courts eyes, the father then is the victim, the helpless, hapless. Gavel thrown by the judge, Sperm donor to the court, all I want is to be given an opportunity to show you who I am.

Judge, I award Mr. POS, to have his parental rights, let him have his child, visitation, his baby, yes unsupervised. How many voiceless, innocents "human targets" to be caught in the cross fire - that lose everything. Some to lose their lives, others to lose their minds, bodies, spirits. Over a war that is spun, by a stack of paper, and a file number. It happens every day. Abuse comes in all forms. Abuse inflicted unto some children, that is life long, a fate worse than death. * Let go or be dragged* fits here.

Anonymous said...

I don'tknow anything about this case but the mother's words also give me goose bumps. What's with the 'baby boy'? Deeply freaky.

Shelley said...

My mother is a pathological liar. I see a lot of similarities with this as with her letters/emails which is her preferred method of response when confronted with her lies. You have to all admit, its easier to try to do this written than spoken. You can correct yourself, backtrack and keep your self clear. Still showing guilt.
I accused her of a lie about something her ex did. Instead of providing proof which with this case, would be as simple as her logging into her account and printing the proof and sending to me…. She has brought up all these “wrongs” done to her over the years. This guy did this to her, that guy did that. Even has brought up things that were done wrong to her father 50 years ago.
This guy does the same. He talks more about how he has been wrongly accused of “this and that” than addressing the issue. The death of his son.
And considering that the loss of your child should destroy a parent emotionally, I find anyone able to write so much and bring up so much about nothing…. To really be prove they are hiding something.
They are worried about covering their lies and not at all about what really happened. Which means the lie is the most sensitive thing. Not the loss of the child. Put the 2 together and you have such clear guilt.

Anonymous said...

I just pulled up the photos of him that Vida provided.

He has eyes like Jodie Arias. Cold and empty.

Anonymous said...

He should have run this by his lawyer before posting it.

Why are people allowed to have life insurance on their minor children anyway?

JerseyJane said...

Yup, Vita......The destruction of Innocence....Where is that protective bubble that they receive when placed in ur hands upon entering this world?

Shelley, the evil that they both brew can be smelled, ur words are so true..