Monday, January 31, 2022

Ellen Greenburg Death: 911 Call Analysis Sam Goldberg

 

Ellen and her Dad

This case has been ruled as a suicide.  Ellen was found with 20 stab wounds.  


I. The 911 Call

II. The Call with Analysis Notes 

III. Analysis Conclusion



Sam Goldberg:              Help! I've got, I need, I need, uh, [inaudible]. I just, I just walked into my apartment, my fiance's on the floor with blood everywhere.


911 Receptionis...:        What is the address? 


Sam Goldberg:              46-0-1 Flat Rock Road. Please come! Help! 

911 Receptionis...:        46-0-1-


Sam Goldberg:              Now!


911 Receptionis...:        Flat Rock-

Sam Goldberg:              Flat Rock Road. 


911 Receptionis...:        Is this a house or apartment? 

Sam Goldberg:              Oh, no! Oh, no! 


911 Receptionis...:        Is this a house or an apartment? 

Sam Goldberg:              It's an apartment.


911 Receptionis...:        What apartment number? 


Sam Goldberg:              [inaudible]. Please, hurry! Please. 


911 Receptionis...:        Where is she bleeding from? 

Sam Goldberg:              She, I don't know, I can't tell. She's-


911 Receptionis...:        Now, sir, you have to calm yourself down in order to get you some help.


Sam Goldberg:              I'm sorry, I'm sorry. She-


911 Receptionis...:        Okay.


Sam Goldberg:              I don't know. I, I'm looking at her right now. She, I don't know, I can't see anything. She doesn't, there's nothing broken. She's bleeding. Ellie!


911 Receptionis...:        You don't know where she's bleeding from? 


Sam Goldberg:              Ellie!


911 Receptionis...:        You can't see where the blood's coming from? 

Sam Goldberg:              It's I think her head. I think she hit her head, I think, but [crosstalk]-


911 Receptionis...:        [crosstalk] might have fallen? 


Sam Goldberg:              Everywhere. 


911 Receptionis...:        [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:              It's everywhere.


911 Receptionis...:        Do you think she might have fallen? 

Sam Goldberg:              Uh, yeah.


911 Receptionis...:        Do you know what happened to her? 

Sam Goldberg:              Uh, she, she, she may have slipped. There's blood on the, on the table. Her, her face is a little purple.


911 Receptionis...:        Okay, hold on for rescue for her. Stay on the phone. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Philadelphia Fire Department 8-4-2. What's the address? [inaudible]-


Sam Goldberg:              Uh, 46-0-1 Flat Rock Road. Please hurry.

Philadelphia Fi...:          46-0-1 Flat Rock? 

Sam Goldberg:              Yes.


Philadelphia Fi...:          What's wrong? 


Sam Goldberg:              My, like I just, my, I went downstairs to go workout, I came back up, the door was latched, my fiances inside, she wasn't, she wasn't answering, so after about a half hour I decided to break it down, and I see her now just on the floor b- bloody. She's not, she's not responding. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay. Is she breathing? 

Sam Goldberg:              She, I can't-


Philadelphia Fi...:          Look at her chest. I need you to calm down and I need you to look at her chest. It's really-


Sam Goldberg:              I don't think she, I really don't think she is.

Philadelphia Fi...:          Sir, listen. Listen to me. Someone's on the way. Look at her chest. Is she flat on her back? 


Sam Goldberg:              She's on her back. Do I bring her-


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, look at her chest and tell me if it's going up and down, up and down? 


Sam Goldberg:              I don't see her moving.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay. Do you know how to do CPR? 


Sam Goldberg:              I don't.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, I can tell you what to do, okay, until they get there. I want you to keep her flat [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:              Oh, God.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Hello? 

Sam Goldberg:              Yeah, hi. Okay. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Are you willing to do CPR with me over the phone until they get there? 

Sam Goldberg:              I guess I, I have to, right? 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay. So get her flat on her back, bare her chest, okay? You want to rip her shirt off.


Sam Goldberg:              Gosh. [inaudible].


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay? Feel down by her side.

Sam Goldberg:              Oh my god. Ellie, please.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Listen, listen, you can't freak out, sir, because you've got to-


Sam Goldberg:              Okay, I'm trying not to.

Philadelphia Fi...:          [crosstalk].

Sam Goldberg:              I'm trying not to. Her shirt won't come off, it's a zipper. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Rip it off.


Sam Goldberg:              Oh my god, she stabbed herself! 

Philadelphia Fi...:          Where? 


Sam Goldberg:              She fell on a knife. Oh, no, her knife's sticking out.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Her what? 

Sam Goldberg:              There's a knife sticking out of her heart.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Oh, she stabbed herself? 

Sam Goldberg:              I guess, I guess so, I don't know, or she fell on it, I don't know. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, well don't touch it.

Sam Goldberg:              Okay, so I just, I just let her [inaudible] now? 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Somebody-

Sam Goldberg:              I mean, what do I do?


Philadelphia Fi...:          Oh, I mean, you can't, if the knife is in her chest it's going to be kind of hard for you to do CPR at this time.

Sam Goldberg:              Oh, no. Oh my goodness. Okay. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Police, which operator? 

Speaker 4:                    2-7-7. 

Philadelphia Fi...:          All right, [inaudible]-


Sam Goldberg:              Is someone coming here? 

Philadelphia Fi...:          Yes, they are. You said 46-0-1 Flat Rock, right? 

Sam Goldberg:              Yes. 

Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, someone's on the way. And the knife is still inside?


Sam Goldberg:              Is there what? 

Philadelphia Fi...:          The knife is still inside of her? 


Sam Goldberg:              Yes, I didn't take it out.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Is it her chest or what area does it [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:              It's in her chest. It's like, it looks like it's-

Philadelphia Fi...:          [crosstalk]. 


Sam Goldberg:              It looks like it's right in her heart.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Oh, okay. Someone's on the way out there, okay? Just get the door open.


Sam Goldberg:              Oh my god. Oh my god. Okay, thank you.

Philadelphia Fi...:          How old is she? 


Sam Goldberg:              She's 27. 

Philadelphia Fi...:          27. There's no sign of life at all? 

Sam Goldberg:              No. 


Philadelphia Fi...:          All right, pinch under her arm.


Sam Goldberg:              No, no, please, don't be. What? 


Philadelphia Fi...:          Pinch her under her arm and tell me if she responds to pain? 


Sam Goldberg:              She's ... Ellie! She's not, it's not, her arm, her hands are still warm. I don't know what that means, but there's blood everywhere. I mean-


Philadelphia Fi...:          I know, but you can't. And the knife is still inside of her. How far? Can you see how far it went in?

Sam Goldberg:              It looks pretty deep. 

Philadelphia Fi...:          Oh, okay. 

Sam Goldberg:              It looks three-

Philadelphia Fi...:          All right. 

Sam Goldberg:              I mean, it's a long knife.

Speaker 4:                    Don't touch anything, sir.

Philadelphia Fi...:          Yeah, don't touch anything, okay? 

Sam Goldberg:              I'm not touching anything. [crosstalk]-

Philadelphia Fi...:          [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:              I can't believe this. Uh-

Philadelphia Fi...:          So, what, it was just you there with her? 

Sam Goldberg:              We, yeah, we're the only ones here. 

Philadelphia Fi...:          And she ran in the door, you said, and latched it shut? 

Sam Goldberg:              No, no. I, I, I went downstairs to workout and I, when I came back up the door was latched.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Oh.


Sam Goldberg:              Like it wasn't, you know, it wasn't like it was, you know, it was like locked from the inside, and I'm yelling, and, uh, so I was-


Philadelphia Fi...:          Well-

Sam Goldberg:              So I'm here yelling, and I guess-

Philadelphia Fi...:          Was the house broken into?

Sam Goldberg:              No, no, no, no.


Philadelphia Fi...:          So there's no sign of a break in? 

Sam Goldberg:              No, no sign of a break in at all. I mean, there will be when you get here, because I had to break the latch, but, to get in.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, 46-0-1 Flat Rock, and this is a house, right? 

Sam Goldberg:              It's an apartment. Flat Rock Road, Apartment [inaudible].

Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay, that'll help [crosstalk]-


Sam Goldberg:              Oh my god. Oh my god. All right, thank you.


Philadelphia Fi...:          Okay. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Sam Goldberg:              Bye. 


II. The Call With Analysis Notes: 


Sam Goldberg:            Help! I've got, I need, I need, uh, [inaudible]. I just, I just walked into my apartment, my fiancé’s on the floor with blood everywhere.

The call begins with “help”--- for whom does he ask for help.  Our expectation (and presumption of truthfulness) is that the caller will ask for help for the victim. The exception to this is when the caller asks for help on how to perform CPR or administer first aid.  

 

Q. Does the caller, himself, need “help”?  We let the subject (caller) guide our answer.  He next says, “I’ve got” followed by, “I need, I need” and self censoring or inaudible. 

Here, believing his words to guide us, he tells us that he has a need (twice) without identifying what that need is, or how it relates to the victim (“my fiancé needs help, she is bleeding”, etc) 

 

We note that he did not ask for help for the victim. 

We note that he did not ask for help for himself to save the victim.

We note he repeated, “I need”, which increases its importance. 

We believe the subject has a “need.” 

We note that he asks for help--- is this for himself?  Is he in need of help?  Or is he asking for help for another? We look to the rest of the transcript (statement) to guide us. 

This is sometimes found in guilty callers in Emergency Calls, particularly in domestic assaults and domestic homicides. 

 

Priority:  The order of words (information) speaks to the caller’s priority. 

1.     Help 

2.     I’ve got. What does he “got”?  His own troubles? Did he get “her”? 

3.     I need, I need. What does he need?  We expect him to tell us what he needs. 

4.     I just

5.     I just walked in to my apartment

He has not yet addressed the needs, nor the need for assistance for the victim. 

Expectation of innocence--- the first thing to say is about the victim. 

Instead, he gives a non specific call for help, expresses with heavy pronoun usage (“I”) regarding himself, that he “got, need, need” and the timing (“just”) and location. 

 

A conversation should flow in one direction. Here it is out of sequence. the word "just" repeated takes him back and could be similar to the word "left" as it interrupts his train of thought or natural flow. it's repetition increases the sensitivity and could seek to provide him with a linguistic alibi which should be unnecessary in context. The priority should be to get help yet he prioritizes himself and stops the flow of information

“my apartment” --- he takes ownership of the apartment while his fiancé is in an emergency setting.  

 

I just, I just walked into my apartment, my fiancé’s on the floor with blood everywhere.

a.     “just” speaks to timing.  It is not expected that he would have a need to repeat (emphasis) this point, unless he has a need.   

b.     Q. With the repetition, was he there earlier than this call?

c.     “walked” is slow, deliberate method of entry. It portrays a casualness about entry. This is incongruent with his description of breaking into his apartment.

d.     By telling us his body posture, we note that he is slowing down the pace of the statement and indicating tension for him, at this point, in the recall process. 

 

He began with “help” and we expect him to continue this, as a call to help his fiancé.  Instead, he turns the focus upon himself; his arrival timing (2x), his walking, his apartment.  Thus far, he is the priority. He wishes to communicate that he was not home. This is a priority before getting to the victim. 

 

my fiancé’s on the floor with blood everywhere.

a.     “my fiancé” shows ownership which often indicates at the time and setting of the statement, that at this point, it is a good relationship.  Please note that this is his perception of reality and that it comes while she is on the floor, with blood everywhere. 

b.     We sometimes find, in the subject’ verbalized perception of reality in domestic homicides that the relationship was volatile until the victim’s death. 

c.     “on the floor” (location) to which he is standing (“walked in”).  His information prior to telling police that his fiancé is bleeding is unnecessary and slows down the pace of the statement.  He is standing, she is down, she is his. 

d.     blood everywhere” is as to be startled, by one who “just” (repeated) “walked” (slow, casual, not alarmed).

e.     This also avoids telling us that “she is bleeding”, or assigning the ownership of the blood to her. This passivity is often used to conceal responsibility for the one who caused her blood to be “everywhere.”

f.      Also by not saying (in any manner) that “my fiancé is bleeding” (followed by “how do I stop the blood?” in any wording, he may be subtly depersonalizing her.  This is done while she is “my fiancé.”

g.     With his use of passivity, rather than ascribe the blood to her, does he know she is beyond help? (He has not yet asked for help for her, nor has he has asked for help for himself to stop the bleeding) 

h.     with” between her and “blood everywhere” is a psychological distancing or separation of her from her own blood.  

i.      To this point, we do not see anything in his words about her breathing, still bleeding, crying, screaming, whimpering, etc.  The subject is distancing himself from her in what is absent. 

j.      Since he began his call with “help”, we remaining looking for him to tell them what help he needs; such as in CPR or a tourniquet. 

k.     What happened to her should be his priority; not self. 

l.      Does the subject exhibit or is known for narcissistic tendencies?

m.   Going out of order (and slowing down the pace) may indicate that he is not speaking from experiential memory, but of memory rehearsed as to what to say.  

 

911                              What is the address? 

Sam Goldberg:            46-0-1 Flat Rock Road. Please come! Help!

911                              46-0-1-

Sam Goldberg:            Now!

What now?  

We continue to wait for him to ask for help for the victim.

We continue to wait for him to give police a description of what she needs. 

911                              Flat Rock-

Sam Goldberg:            Flat Rock Road.

911                              Is this a house or apartment? 

Sam Goldberg:            Oh, no! Oh, no!

For whom is he concerned?  Himself or the victim?  We do not know from his words. 

This is something people commonly say when they have made a mistake or been caught at something. 

911                              Is this a house or an apartment? 

Sam Goldberg:            It's an apartment.

911                              What apartment number? 

Sam Goldberg:            [inaudible]. Please, hurry! Please.

Ingratiation---- this is when politeness is used in an attempt to be perceived as helpful and aligned with police.  It often indicates to the contrary.  Here, he repeats the word please, urges them to “hurry”, but he does not say why, nor does he ask for help to administer aid to the victim.  Ingratiation is used to appear to be the “good guy” when one may be seeking to hide guilt. He wishes to be perceived as friendly, on the same team, but not as one to be investigated by police. 

911                              Where is she bleeding from?

This is an unexpected question.  The 911 operator must ask this question because the subject has not given any indication of the victim’s current status beyond location. Callers in distress are in earnest to obtain help for the victim. He has not expressed what “need” she has, or what “help” she specifically needs. This caused the operator to have to inquire. 

 

Sam Goldberg:            She, I don't know, I can't tell. She's-

Why can’t he tell?  Why hasn’t he looked?  Why hasn’t he tried to save her?  To stop the blood that is “everywhere”?  

911                              Now, sir, you have to calm yourself down in order to get you some help.

Sam Goldberg:            I'm sorryI'm sorry. She-

We highlight the words, “I’m sorry” in an emergency call in all settings.  It is sometimes found in guilty callers. Here, it is repeated.  Those truly in earnest to save the victim do not care to be polite; they care only about saving the life. When there are other points of analysis that concern us, we seek to learn if the subject, himself, has something to be “sorry” for in this specific context. Here, while calling about her, does he have regrets? 

911                              Okay.

Sam Goldberg:            I don't know. I, I'm looking at her right now. She, I don't know, I can't see anything. She doesn't, there's nothing broken. She's bleeding. Ellie!

 

The question is where is she bleeding from.  His answer is “I don’t know.”  This is to answer the question and he could have stopped there.  He gives us a “hina clause” which I used to explain why, even though he was not asked.  This is very sensitive information to him and it yields much for us to understand. 

“looking at her” is very concerning.  Besides unnecessarily attempting to show that he wasn’t previously 

 

“I, I’m” is a slight halt on the pronoun “I”--- the pronoun “I” is something we all use millions of times with proficiency.  Halting on it indicates that there is an increase in stress/anxiety found in these words:  “looking at her right now.”

Please note that it is only “right now” that he is “looking at her.”  He wants police to know that he may not have been looking at her previously.  This is impossible, yet within his words, it was not her blood, but “blood everywhere.”  

 

This is a strong indication that he was looking at her prior to this call and knows more than what he is revealing.  He wants police to believe he did not see anything.  This need, itself, is what he highlight.  It is a need to persuade police that he is ignorant of wounds. 

 

He is indicating a time gap.  He did early with the repeating of “just” 

He now assigns the blood to her, as “bleeding”, while he is looking at her. 

 

He does not question if someone did this to her.  There is no open wondering of who did this to the victim. 

He’s looking at her now, but not offering her any help, nor asking for help for her, nor for himself in first aid applied to her.  

 

Nothing. 

 

This may have surprised the operator into asking this: 

 

911                              You don't know where she's bleeding from?

Sam Goldberg:            Ellie!

The “unintended recipient” is often more important than the intended.  In this context, (911) the intended recipient is the operator, but the unintended recipient may be the 911 recording (see ingratiation) 

911.:                            You can't see where the blood's coming from? 

He said he was “looking” at her “right now.” 

Sam Goldberg:            It's I think her head. I think she hit her head, I think, but [crosstalk]-

Repetition of “I think” , along with the self rebuttal (“but”) may indicate, at this point, that he knows exactly where she is bleeding from. 

 

911                              [crosstalk] might have fallen?

Sam Goldberg:            Everywhere

911 ...:                         [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:            It's everywhere.

911 ...:                         Do you think she might have fallen? 

This is difficult because we do not wish to give answers to a subject, but the operator may have been trying to focus how to guide for first aid, since the caller has given no indication of how she should be treated. 

Sam Goldberg:            Uh, yeah.

He agrees with her rather than offering his own info, since he is “looking at her right now” 

What else was he looking at? (prior to this moment in the call) 

911 ...:                         Do you know what happened to her?

Yes or no question; operator may have grown suspicious by now.  

Sam Goldberg:            Uh, she, she, she may have slipped. There's blood on the, on the table. Her, her face is a littlepurple.

a.     He does not answer the question. 

b.     He offers that she may have slipped; no concern that she was murdered and that the killer could still be in the apartment.  

c.     “a little purple” should cause him to ask, “What do I do?” to save her life.  He does not. 

911:                             Okay, hold on for rescue for her. Stay on the phone

Philadelphia FD:         Philadelphia Fire Department 8-4-2. What's the address? [inaudible]-

Sam Goldberg:            Uh, 46-0-1 Flat Rock Road. Please hurry.

He has not sought help to apply first aid, stop the bleeding, etc.  

He uses the polite, “please” with the FD.  

Philadelphia Fi...:       46-0-1 Flat Rock? 

Sam Goldberg:            Yes.

Philadelphia Fi...:       What's wrong? 

Good question

Sam Goldberg:            My, like I just, my, I went downstairs to go workout, I came back up, the door was latched, my fiancé’s inside, she wasn't, she wasn't answering, so after about a half hour I decided to break it down, and I see her now just on the floor b- bloody. She's not, she's not responding.

The subject is withholding information at this point in the statement. 

The subject has a need to explain why he went downstairs. 

The subject has the need to elongate time.  (“half hour”)

The subject needed time to “decide” to break in.  

Did she lock him out and wouldn't respond to him wanting to get back in so he broke back in and killed her

How did he know she was inside?  If he was gone and needed “30 minutes”, could she have not left? Gone for a walk? 

He states that she was inside; we believe him.  He knew.  

 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay. Is she breathing?

Sam Goldberg:            She, I can't-

Philadelphia Fi...:       Look at her chest. I need you to calm down and I need you to look at her chest. It's really-

Sam Goldberg:            I don't think she, I really don't think she is.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Sir, listen. Listen to me. Someone's on the way. Look at her chest. Is she flat on her back?

Sam Goldberg:            She's on her back. Do I bring her-

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, look at her chest and tell me if it's going up and down, up and down?

Sam Goldberg:            I don't see her moving.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay. Do you know how to do CPR?

Sam Goldberg:            I don't.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, I can tell you what to do, okay, until they get there. I want you to keep her flat [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:            Oh, God.

Note use of Deity in the emergency call 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Hello? 

Sam Goldberg:            Yeah, hi. Okay.

He uses language of ingratiation, likely instinctively.  He wants to be perceived as helpful. Yet, the FD had to ask him if he was “willing”--

Philadelphia Fi...:       Are you willing to do CPR with me over the phone until they get there

Sam Goldberg:            I guess I, I have to, right?

The subject did not ask for help for the victim.

The subject did not ask help for himself to tend to the victim.

The subject openly states his reluctance. 

The victim was likely dead by this point and the subject may not have wanted to be close to the body.  This may help us understand the need to say “I am looking at her right now…”

The subject knew she was dead.  

He was previously “looking at her.” 

He knew. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay. So get her flat on her back, bare her chest, okay? You want to rip her shirt off.

Sam Goldberg:            Gosh. [inaudible].

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay? Feel down by her side.

Sam Goldberg:            Oh my God. Ellie, please.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Listen, listen, you can't freak out, sir, because you've got to-

Sam Goldberg:            Okay, I'm trying not to.

Philadelphia Fi...:       [crosstalk].

Sam Goldberg:            I'm trying not to. Her shirt won't come off, it's a zipper.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Rip it off.

Sam Goldberg:            Oh My god, she stabbed herself!

What caused him to think and say this? Why would this be the first thing on his mind upon seeing a knife to the chest?

He has jumped to the conclusion of the matter.  

He blames the victim.  

Negative LD.  

He went slowly through this rather than going directly to her to save her---he is likely lengthening time again. 

 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Where? 

Sam Goldberg:            She fell on a knife. Oh, no, her knife's sticking out.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Her what?

Sam Goldberg:            There's a knife sticking out of her heart.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Oh, she stabbed herself?

FD is surprised at this conclusion. 

Sam Goldberg:            I guess, I guess so, I don't know, or she fell on it, I don't know. 

He now backs away from his earlier commitment with “guess” and repetition of “I don’t know.” It is likely he wishes this to be seen as a suicide. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, well don't touch it.

Sam Goldberg:            Okay, so I just, I just let her [inaudible] now

Philadelphia Fi...:       Somebody-

Sam Goldberg:            I mean, what do I do?

Philadelphia Fi...:       Oh, I mean, you can't, if the knife is in her chest it's going to be kind of hard for you to do CPR at this time.

Sam Goldberg:            Oh, no. Oh my goodness. Okay.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Police, which operator? 

Speaker 4:                   2-7-7. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       All right, [inaudible]-

Sam Goldberg:            Is someone coming here?

Philadelphia Fi...:       Yes, they are. You said 46-0-1 Flat Rock, right? 

Sam Goldberg:            Yes. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, someone's on the way. And the knife is still inside?

Sam Goldberg:            Is there what?

Philadelphia Fi...:       The knife is still inside of her? 

Sam Goldberg:            Yes, I didn't take it out.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Is it her chest or what area does it [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:            It's in her chest. It's like, it looks like it's-

Philadelphia Fi...:       [crosstalk]. 

Sam Goldberg:            It looks like it's right in her heart.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Oh, okay. Someone's on the way out there, okay? Just get the door open.

Sam Goldberg:            Oh my God. Oh my God. Okay, thank you.

He retains the presence of mind to be polite to authorities.  

Philadelphia Fi...:       How old is she? 

Sam Goldberg:            She's 27. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       27. There's no sign of life at all? 

Sam Goldberg:            No.

Philadelphia Fi...:       All right, pinch under her arm.

Sam Goldberg:            No, no, please, don't be. What?

Philadelphia Fi...:       Pinch her under her arm and tell me if she responds to pain? 

Sam Goldberg:            She's ... Ellie! She's not, it's not, her arm, her hands are still warm. I don't know what that means, but there's blood everywhere. I mean-

Philadelphia Fi...:       I know, but you can't. And the knife is still inside of her. How far? Can you see how far it went in?

Sam Goldberg:            It looks pretty deep.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Oh, okay. 

Sam Goldberg:            It looks three-

Philadelphia Fi...:       All right. 

Sam Goldberg:            I mean, it's a long knife.

Speaker 4:                   Don't touch anything, sir.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Yeah, don't touch anything, okay? 

Sam Goldberg:            I'm not touching anything. [crosstalk]-

Philadelphia Fi...:       [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:            I can't believe this. Uh-

Philadelphia Fi...:       So, what, it was just you there with her? 

Sam Goldberg:            We, yeah, we're the only ones here. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       And she ran in the door, you said, and latched it shut? 

This question caused him anxiety.  

Sam Goldberg:            No, no. I, I, I went downstairs to workout and I, when I came back up the door was latched.

He stated that she was inside, but here he uses passivity regarding the latching of the door.  This removes responsibility from the person who latched it. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Oh.

Sam Goldberg:            Like it wasn't, you know, it wasn't like it was, you know, it was like locked from the inside, and I'm yelling, and, uh, so I was-

He refuses to commit to this account.  He reports what it was “like”, three times.  “You know” also follows his anxiety, indicating an increased awareness of the person he is talking to (who asked the question) and his need to get the FD to believe/agree with him. 

Philadelphia Fi...:       Well-

Sam Goldberg:            So I'm here yelling, and I guess-

Philadelphia Fi...:       Was the house broken into? 

Sam Goldberg:            No, no, no, no.

Philadelphia Fi...:       So there's no sign of a break in? 

Sam Goldberg:            No, no sign of a break in at all. I mean, there will be when you get here, because I had to break the latch, but, to get in.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, 46-0-1 Flat Rock, and this is a house, right? 

Sam Goldberg:            It's an apartment. Flat Rock Road, Apartment [inaudible].

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay, that'll help [crosstalk]-

Sam Goldberg:            Oh my god. Oh my god. All right, thank you.

Philadelphia Fi...:       Okay. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Sam Goldberg:            Bye. 

 

      III.  Analysis Conclusion: 


1.     The subject (caller) should be investigated as  a suspect in the death of Ellen Greenburg. This indicates that an investigation should not only include the possibility of directly causing her death, but should also examine any possible destabilizing of Ellen in the hours/days prior to this call. 


2.     The subject is withholding information about what happened to Ellen.


3.     The subject did not ask for help for the victim.


4.     The subject did not ask for guidance to administer first aid to the victim.  The subject expressed reluctance in providing aid to the victim. 


5.     The subject’s priority is himself; not the victim. 



6.     The subject likely was at the scene longer than he offered.


7.     The subject indicates that during the call, he knew Ellen was beyond help. 


8.     Despite finding his fiancé is this state, he did not show fear nor concern of an intruder.


9.  The subject knew his fiancé was inside. 


10.  The subject did not always  speak from experiential memory, but from rehearsed or scripted responses.


11.  The subject wants police to be convinced that this was suicide.  



 


28 comments:

Gavin Stone official said...

Fantastic analysis. I agree with everything you've stated and I think that you've done a brilliant job of dissecting this. There not really anything of value that I can add, only a couple of observations that you're more than likely already aware of.
I spotted a negative towards the beginning that raised a red flag when he the caller said "There's nothing broken". He cant even perform CPR and now he has the x-ray vision of a ER triage nurse. How does he know there's nothing broken, or is he referring to property?
There was changes from past to present tense and back again a couple of times, which may mean nothing, experience tells me otherwise though.
Several times he mention that he was "Looking at her right now" and was instructed to watch her chest to see if she was breathing and yet failed to spot a knife sticking out of her chest until instructed to perform CPR. Not sure how he could have missed it, giving him the benefit of the doubt here, leads me to the next observation, when told to now not perform CPR he response is simply "Oh no, on my goodness, okay." At this point I would have deemed it logical for him to have asked the question: "Is there anything else I can do?" he doesn't and simply dismisses it and moves on. Not the actions of a person trying in any way to save the life of a loved one.
Finally, he stops in the process of talking about the knife and how deep in it is. he self edits when describing it with the word "THREE" where his sentence is incomplete and then changes to "I mean it's a long knife" In my opinion demonstrating familiarity with the knife or how else would he know?
The little bits I've mentioned are nowhere near as solid as your analysis which was precise as well as incredibly thorough. You executed a meticulous and professional examination that is top tier work in my opinion. Thank you for the opportunity to take a look.

Anonymous said...

OT: Is there a statistic in statement analysis where the use of "bizarre" may indicate disbelief of reported media stories or knowledge of a widespread coverup?

Anonymous said...

Also OT re "bizarre". Might "puzzling" and "conundrum" fall into the same category?

Hamish said...

Philadelphia FD: Are you willing to do CPR with me over the phone until they get there?
Sam Goldberg: I guess I, I have to, right?

You don't have to, Sam, but if you don't do CPR or even if you express that you might not want to, it kind of makes you look like you want her to die which, given the circumstances, is highly suspicious and so so callous.
I'm equal parts mystified, angry, and sad that he responded in such a way
That part of the exchange is so chilling.
Fascinating analysis as usual, Mr Hyatt.

N said...

OT: Summer W case

FLOWERS

Does anyone know the importance of the word FLOWERS in Statement Analysis?
Is it a sensitive word, such as “shower, door, “ etc. .?

The mother mentions the word FLOWERS at least 8 times during the same interview…





Sharon said...

N, I'm not an expert by any means, but my take would be that either the flowers are deeply impressed on her memory of that day, or she wants the interviewer to focus on the flowers (instead of something else).

John Mc Gowan said...

Re Flowers

What is the context?

Anything that is repeated is sensitive and important to the subject.

Hey Jude said...

The knife is still inside of her?
Yes, I didn’t take it out.

“I haven’t taken it out” or, “I’m not taking it out”, might be more expected if he really had discovered the knife during the emergency call? “Didn’t” sounds too past tense, if that makes sense.

——

OT: Ellie and Jake, parents of little hidden Cleo, have recently given a two million dollar interview.

John Mc Gowan said...

Gavin Stone official said...


I spotted a negative towards the beginning that raised a red flag when he the caller said "There's nothing broken". He cant even perform CPR and now he has the x-ray vision of a ER triage nurse. How does he know there's nothing broken, or is he referring to property?

Hi, Gavin

Could this also be leakage. Does he have a history of DV, "Broken" bones etc.

Anonymous said...

"The knife is still inside of her?
Yes, I didn’t take it out.

“I haven’t taken it out” or, “I’m not taking it out”, might be more expected if he really had discovered the knife during the emergency call? “Didn’t” sounds too past tense, if that makes sense."

It does make sense.

I put it in, but I didn't take it out...?

N said...

OT Summer Wells case

Hi John!

The context is the mother describing the last activites with her daughter before her disappearance.

At the swimming hole (lake) the interviewer asked what Summer was doing. The mother answered:
“Summer was just playing in the water…etc . all the flowers that died were there… there were a bunch of flowers, I guess they all died now. She was jumping like a NORMAL kid. “

Interviewer asked what happened on the way home from swimming hole, (in car) the mother answered: “we were sitting there talking trees, flowers, rocks…”
At home events right before desappearance, grandma wanted to transplant plants, the mother asked her daughter: “Do you want to plant flowers? “ than she goes on and on about flowers and transplanting: “…flower planting, she jumped up…. pretty flowers….flowers transplanted, etc…” I do not believe they planted anything that day, but this word is sensitive.

Flowers in crime stories, detective novels :
“The flower is widely associated with death in detective novels, variously designating the actual victim, being present at the scene of the crime, decorating cemeteries, acting as the murder weapon or as a clue for the detective”

Interview: https://youtu.be/0ZdQtAMQIkc
(8:39 and 21:40 min)

N said...

It is interesting he reports seeing the zipper first, and noticing the big knife in her chest only after the zipper.

HER knife - I wonder why he gave ownership of that knife to her. Were there 1 or more knives causing the stab wounds?

After reading the 911 call and the autopsy report, it is surprising police ruled this case a suicide. 20 stab wounds (a lot of them through clothes) some at the back of her neck at spinal cord….no way to do that by herself.



Seagull said...

Hey Jude said...
The knife is still inside of her?
Yes, I didn’t take it out.

“I haven’t taken it out” or, “I’m not taking it out”, might be more expected if he really had discovered the knife during the emergency call? “Didn’t” sounds too past tense, if that makes sense.

This is a very good point Hey Jude. This follows:
"She stabbed herself"
"Her knife is sticking out"
Responder asks - "she stabbed herself?"
"I guess so" - uncertainty follows the previous certainty.
Responder says - "Well just don't touch it"
Only 10 seconds or so pass between being instructed not to touch the knife and him unnecessarily saying, beyond the expected "yes" "I didn't take it out." These 5 words are unnecessary making it necessary for him to say it.

Given the amount of time which has passed between the instruction of not to touch and the unnecessary assertion of not taking it out, "didn't" could be indicative of more time having passed potentially between the death and the call being made. I'm wondering with the unnecessary emphasis on the negative "didn't" take it out whether he is thinking anything else? "I didn't take it out" Did he put it in?

Robert said...

Peter:

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2021/01/16/pipe-bomb-near-rnc-found-madison-native-karlin-younger/4189043001/

"...I better find someone"

Mouse74 said...

Statement Analysis aside, which is very telling...

I don't feel it's possible for someone to go through the act of stabbing themselves 20 times, let alone once right into their own heart? The body's natural flinch reaction would kick in, no?

How could anyone call this suicide? What am I missing? Seems so obvious that stabbing oneself 20 times is not a method of suicide. Is this actually something suicidal people can do? 20 stabs? Pound 20 times on a desk. No way she would keep going until that final stab in her heart. I'm dumbfounded. Her family must be so distraught with this ruling.

Hey Jude said...

Yes, Seagull, and I agree that “her knife”- (follow the pronouns) - invites the question as to whether he had a knife, too. I think one would be more inclined to say “a knife” throughout rather than also use “her knife”, so there must be a reason for his personalisation of the knife. Maybe more than one knife was used, or it’s an effort to convince it was suicide because it’s “her” knife.

Did Ellen have a special knife, though - a kitchen knife which she alone used, or maybe a hunting knife, a ceremonial type, a dagger, which might reasonably cause him to distinguish it as hers, rather than just a knife? Unknown, but even if she did, I still wouldn’t believe she stabbed herself multiple times in the back of her neck with it, or that his 911 call wasn’t suspicious.

Maybe “her knife” is due to Ellen being in possession of the knife when she was attacked. Did she grab a knife to defend herself only to be attacked before she even had time to turn round?

—-

“Do you know what happened to her?
Sam Goldberg: Uh, she, she, she may have slipped. There's blood on the, on the table. Her, her face is a little purple.”

He can’t say “no”, he won’t say “yes” - though it’s a simple enough question and, realistically, he could not have avoided seeing the knife. His evasion of the question, along with minimisation “her face is a little purple” reminds me of Davey Blackburn not noticing Amanda had been shot three times, or that anyone had been in “his” house, yet Davey, also, has had nothing for which to account.

So contemptible - I find it hard to be objective. Will Davey’s 911 call ever be made available?


John Mc Gowan said...

OT:

‘Just return Lina back’: Father of missing 3-year-old girl recounts sorrowful month after daughter reported missing

SAPD says Lina’s disappearance remains a missing person case.

Note. His (Fathers) words are translated by a interpreter so may not be accurate. The order of words may not be correctly placed, there maybe additions and or subtractions by interpreter. Also note the passing of time may impact his language (Past tense)

It’s been one month since 3-year-old Lina Khil disappeared, and police have no leads on her whereabouts and are still calling this a missing person’s case. Her family is asking whoever has her to return her to a safe place.

Riaz Khil, Lina’s father, said his home is filled with sorrow and sadness since Lina disappeared on Dec. 20 from outside the family’s home at Villas del Cabo apartments. Lina’s mother, the last person to see her, says she just wants her daughter back.

“She’s very unhappy, and she is very sad and crying all the time, all the time. When she’s sitting at room or apartment, she’s crying and wants Lina back home,” said Riaz Khil through translator Lawang Mangal.

Khil, who will turn 4 years old next month, is described as a happy toddler who loves to play makeovers with her friends.

“She had the makeup tools and dolls, and most of all, she liked to wear red dresses -- red traditional dress. So she liked the red color very much. She was a lovable girl,” Riaz Khil said.

After weeks of searches, San Antonio police have no leads and still call it a missing person’s case.

Lina’s parents are still hopeful that she will be found alive. The family remembers a lot of activity around the apartment complex with people coming in to make repairs, but they can’t say for sure if she was taken.

There’s a $150,000 reward for information that leads to the child’s whereabouts. Riaz Khil is asking that whoever has her come forward and collect the reward.

“Just leave her somewhere in a safe place and go,” he said. “There’s no offense. There is no revenge, and I will forgive him from my heart. Just return Lina back.”

More in Vt

Lina has a 2-year-old brother, and her mother is expecting another child in the summer. Her family continues to wait on information related to her disappearance. Anyone with information is asked to call SAPD Missing Person’s Unit at 210-207-7660.

https://www.ksat.com/news/local/2022/01/21/just-return-lina-back-father-of-missing-3-year-old-girl-recounts-sorrowful-month-after-daughter-reported-missing/

Mum speaks out:

Again it is through a translator so the above still applies.

4 Feb 2022.

Exclusive: The mother of missing 3 year-old Lina Khil shares a message for her child

In the Vt below she is asked "What does she remember of that day"?

https://foxsanantonio.com/newsletter-daily/exclusive-the-mother-of-missing-3-year-old-lina-khil-shares-a-message-for-her-child-family-missing-child-toddler-search-group-exclusive

John Mc Gowan said...

Update on my OT:

Family, volunteers continue search for Lina Sardar Khil

Speaking through a translator, the desperate father spoke about their search.

“We came here at 9 a.m. and have been walking around searching to see if we find anything to lead to Lina,” Riaz said.

Riaz searched the greenbelt, looking for anything that would give them a clue as to where Lina could be.

“Since Lina disappeared, it’s been a long time and every day our pain is increasing, not decreasing. Her mother is missing her child and always crying and in bad shape. To keep us hopeful and motivated, we are now fasting,” Riaz said.

The family won’t eat or drink anything during the day until Lina is found. It’s part of their religion to fast during this difficult time.

Pamela Allen is the founder of Eagle’s Flight, an advocacy group that provides support for families in crisis. She’s been right by Riaz and the family's side, helping to search for Lina.

“We’re not going to give up hope. We are praying, all of us collectively praying for Lina, her safety and her safe return into her father’s arms,” Pamela Allen said.

Allen has worked with other families of missing children in the past and says she feels for them.

“What’s really great about having Lina’s father with us is that when we see things, he’s able to look and let us know if it’s something that is of interest,” Allen said.

The San Antonio Police Department and the FBI are working Lina’s case to find her. The desperate father said his only request is to pray for Lina and to get her back home safely.

“This button is always on my chest and near to my heart," Riaz said. "She was my sweetest daughter and she was my heart, so that’s why it will always be on this spot until we find Lina."

https://spectrumlocalnews.com/tx/south-texas-el-paso/news/2022/02/16/search-for-missing-girl-continues

John Mc Gowan said...

OT:

HI, Peter

I found this in my archive, lol

Statement Analysis: Pronouns:

Soundcloud.

https://soundcloud.com/phyatt1962/statement-analysis-pronouns

Anonymous said...

Will you cover Putin's threats? Is he sincere about using nukes? What does it mean that we should not underestimate "the danger of the consequences"? Is this because he has an expansion rate from Russian to English, otherwise it would be underestimate the danger or underestimate the consequences. But what are we to make of 'the danger of the consequences'? And since they are just 'danger' of consequences - which in itself is a warning - a potential yet to happen - are we to credit what he is saying? Or is he infact just warning us of the 'danger of possible consequences? I hope what I am saying makes sense. Please analyze him.

John Mc Gowan said...

Anons OT @ February 28, 2022 at 11:42 PM


'You should not fail to understand the danger of the consequences'.

"Is he sincere about using nukes?"

Hi

The statement a passive.
What does "danger" look like?
What does "consequences" look like>

Also in this statement (it maybe in others, not from what i have read) as of yet) there is no mention of "using nukes". This is what they want you think. We must not fill in gaps, if he doesn't say it we should not it for him.

In another MSM article there is a pronoun Change from, "You" to "They"

'They cannot fail to understand the degree of danger of the consequences,' the Russian Foreign Ministry's statement read.'

Shoddy reporting, misinterpreted or both?

Hey Jude said...

OT:

Summer’s grandmother, Candus Harer, gives her account of the day Summer disappeared:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdwqhauYjaU

Also:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1wiEZtgA-0

Grandma adds new detail to the timeline, and also says Summer went swimming that day at “the Horse Stables, I believe it was…”.

Would Grandma not be more certain of the location if she had been there, picking flowers, as Hunter and Candus said?

—-

There is more of the interview on the WJHL.com website, which isn’t available to view in Rae UK.

——

Candus has set up her own YouTube channel - unfortunately she almost immediately deleted all but one of her five live videos due to some YouTubers piling in to tear them apart. It’s wild out there, some self-restraint wouldn’t go amiss.

—-

There is a newly released video of one of NK’s interviews - it’s on several YouTube channels already. NK is facing the camera, but the picture quality is not great.

Hey Jude said...

OT: Missing Lina Khil:

A couple of months back, Ickedmel YouTube channel uploaded two conversations with Ezat, an acquaintance of Lina’s father - the conversations relate to Lina and her family’s culture - others may be interested.

Lina section begins at min 6.50 in the first video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1-HEEmMcYg&t=0s


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH-mX9JY4vM

———

The interpreter isn’t translating word for word in the father’s interview, so maybe this case doesn’t have much potential for analysis.

Ezat is interesting, gives good information - somewhat of an apologist, in places, something like a community spokesperson.

Julie L said...

Totally agree I found that statement to be very odd .

That was a yes or no question, the « I didn’t take it out » to me implies he put it there in the first place.

How would you know it’s a large knife that is pretty deep if it’s hidden within her?

It’s nonsense after nonsense

lynda said...

It's absurd this was ruled a suicide. I believe it was reported that the stab wounds around her neck/spinal cord would have been impossible to do herself and caused damage to the degree where she would not have been able to move her arms to keep stabbing herself or to stab herself in her chest.
Is this the case where the BF has some affiliation with LE?

Anonymous said...

Exactly the love of your life is lying on the floor dying, I would expect during any genuine 911 call if they are asked to perform CPR not a single genuine caller would say do I have to, it sounds very suspicious, any genuine boyfriend is going to perform it without any question, as the only priority should be your dying girlfriend.

Anonymous said...

“Her” knife is sticking out. Doesn’t he live there too? Isn’t it HIS knife also? Seems like he is trying to place blame on her and add to the suicide plot and deflect from him as having anything to do with it.

Lisa21222 said...

Cops finally reopen 'suicide' case of 27-year-old Philadelphia teacher found by fiancé in her apartment with 20 stab wounds - including ten to the BACK of her head

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11166011/Cops-REOPEN-case-woman-stabbed-20-times-ruled-suicide-killer.html