Tuesday, October 2, 2012

NYC Teacher Sues School for 6 Year Old's Assault

In determining if this is a false law suit, what do the statements tell you?  It is difficult given the sizes, but stay within the quotes.  

A hulking Queens gym teacher and former college football player claims a pupil fractured his ankle, injured his knee and forced him to go to a shrink for stress — even though the kid was only 50 pounds and in first grade.
Burly, 220-pound PS 330 teacher John Webster, 27, said a 4-foot-2 Rodrigo Carpio, 6, also kicked and pinched the Elmhurst school’s principal, a security officer and another teacher during a rampage in April.
It’s sort of like an angel-devil sort of thing,” said the 5-foot-10 Webster, who recently filed a notice of his intent to sue the city and says he must now wear braces on his right ankle and knee.
‘HUMILIATING’: Gym teacher John Webster says he must now wear knee and ankle braces after Rodrigo Carpio injured him during a tantrum at their Queens school.
‘HUMILIATING’: Gym teacher John Webster says he must now wear knee and ankle braces after Rodrigo Carpio injured him during a tantrum at their Queens school.
“[Rodrigo] looks like an angel, but then, all of a sudden, that halo turns into horns. It’s been a nightmare. It’s embarrassing. It’s humiliating.”
But Rodrigo’s dad, Jorge Carpio, 44, scoffed: “The lawsuit is totally absurd. How could my little boy do so much damage? My poor son.
The boy’s mom added, “This is a terrible thing to say [about] a child.
To every mother, their child is an angel,” said Josefa Marcia da Silva, 33, of her son, now 4-foot-3 and 64 pounds. “I know that he has problems, but he doesn’t deserve to be called such names.”
But Webster’s claims are backed up by an April 26 school “occurrence report” filed by the principal that says Rodrigo “was physically aggressive” and karate-kicked Webster in the knee and ankle that day.
Webster was accompanying Rodrigo and other students to the cafeteria for lunch when the boy started horseplaying, the teacher told The Post.
Webster said that he chided Rodrigo, but that the kid started kicking him.
I tried to hold his wrists, and he began biting me,’’ Webster said. “I took him to the principal’s office, and he kicked me in the ankle, and one kick landed right on my knee. I felt a pop.’’
Rodrigo then kicked and pinched the acting principal and school safety officer, the occurrence report states.
NYPD responded but took no action. The boy’s parents refused to allow him to be taken to a hospital for observation.
Webster, who played tailback for upstate Morrisville State College, said his doctor told him he had to stay away from work for several months because of his physical and emotional state. But a Department of Education doctor told him to go back last month, so “I’m in limbo,’’ Webster said.
Meanwhile, Rodrigo is back at the school.
Webster’s lawyer, Andrew Siben of Bay Shore, LI, said school officials were repeatedly warned about Rodrigo but did not protect his client.
This kid is clearly a tiny terror,” he said. “It’s sad that teachers like Mr. Webster are not offered protection from someone who can endanger other teachers and students.”
Rodrigo’s mom said her son is now on medication so he can focus.
“He is getting help, and he is much better now,” she said.
Both the school principal and the DOE declined to comment


Anonymous said...

The kid is a terror and did what he is accused of.

The parents were aware he was a terror but are ashamed to admit it but have put him on drugs which is an admission in itself.

The teacher was injured, but this emotional stuff and not be at work is BS.

Anonymous said...

Why is the kid posing in a karate position?

His mom says that every mom thinks their kid is and angel....(even if he isn´t)

The report backs up the fact that the kid attacked.

A kid trained in martial arts could give a powerful kick.

If he is ¨much better¨now, how was he before? (worse)

Mom doesn´t deny that he has problems, just says he doesn´t deserve to be called certain names. She never says he didn´t do it.

Also in denial about meds to ¨help him focus¨. Looks like he focused pretty well on attacking the teacher....

Lucy said...

Yep. It sounds like someone's looking for a nice long paid vacation.

I've worked with mentally ill/emotionally disabled youngsters, and I know that even the cute little ones can do some damage when they are in full rage mode. If his complaints were merely physical, fine. I understand. But please. If you are emotionally damaged from a run in with a six year old, perhaps education is not the career for you.

Olckham said...

Some have learning disabilities, some have teaching disabilities...

KatONine said...

I read the report like this: kid was kicking the teacher but when the teacher went to physically restrain the kid, all Hell broke loose. Yeaaah, that would do it. Hands up! Who likes having their personal space invaded by someone much bigger than you? Hands up! Who would like having their wrists restrained by someone much bigger than you? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? ...Yeah, that's what I thought.

Move yourself out of the range of kicks and punches instead of immediately going for a hold because yaknowwhy? Anyone? Because that escalates the situation - especially if someone is already aggressive -and this is a clear textbook case of that.

As for being horribly injured, suck it up, mate. I've been punched, kicked, bitten, slapped, scratched, hair yanked and headbutted in the jaw by kids and guess what? I would never call them 'little terrors' or 'monsters' or 'devils' because I've been taught to dislike the behaviour and not the kid. One of them has said once: "You hate me!" and I replied with: "I hate what you're doing." Maybe it's because I have a good rapport with my students - even the ones who have hurt me - because I am able look past their behaviour and I see more than just a "terror" - I see a person, a little person but a person and the people who can't see past the behaviour and would call a child a "terror" should not be teaching or breeding.

I'm not condoning the behaviour of the kid - hitting is not okay is something I repeat on a daily basis during the work week but this situation could've been handled better with proper education as far behavioural management goes. As for the parents' finding a solution within a pill bottle ...-sigh- You want something that will damage a developing brain? How about medication that alters brain chemistry? That'll do it. Hey, especially since most of the medication used to treat kids for varying issues have never been tested on children - only on adults. I am so tired of people reaching for the pill bottle and believing that those little pills will make everything all better, so bloody tired.

I know people who took those shiny legal drugs as children - guess what? They have more issues now, not less. Now they are dependent on drugs (legal drugs so that makes it okay, right?) because that's what they had feed to them to fix all their problems. It's bollocks, complete bollocks. When I read that a three year old kid is given medication under the reasoning of being 'active', my brain melts a little and all I can say is "...just why?!"

Anonymous said...

Not, "Did my little boy do so much damage?" but "How could my little boy do so much damage?".

Not, "This is a terrible thing for a child to do" but "This is a terrible thing to say [about] a child".

It's like getting caught in a lie and retorting, "How dare you call me a liar! How am I lying?"

skip said...

Kat, you're amazing. Great reply! My children are both "disabled" and they've both given their teachers (self contained classrooms) a run for the money. I apologize, I feel terrible, I advocate for the teachers' protection as well as the kids, and they always brush it off like nothing happened. They are mortal angels for the work they do, and it sounds like you are, too.

These parents must take some responsibility here. If the kid had a broken leg and they ignored it, that's neglect. This is no different. It doesn't mean he needs drugs, but maybe play therapy and having his martial arts teacher mentor him on how bad his behavior was. I know my karate teacher would have banished me from the class for that.
And if he's trying to restrain a child and he doesn't get the moves right immediately, he WILL end up in the hospital.

rob said...

Maybe the kid kicked the 220 lb teacher, but sounds like this teacher is looking for a free-ride on the tax-payers for the rest of his life.
the kid needs to be suspended from school for like a month for the parents to deal with. then maybe he will come back to school with some parental guidence on how to behave in school. It should be a last chance deal, if he does it again, he's out for good. Parents came make an impression on their child, if they are given proper incentive to do it. Some children these days, honestly do not know how to behave in public.

Anonymous said...

As a school employee who frequently deals with unruly children, I am tired of parents being in denial that their little angels are capable of being violent. Last year we had a kid kick the principal so hard that she ended up with two broken ribs. And who did the parent blame? The school, of course! These are the same parents that will be in denial ten years from now when their kid is arrested for assault and will blame the system and the victim rather than themselves for not getting their kid the treatment that they needed to prevent violent behavior as adults.

Anonymous said...

It would be easy to kick a knee cap out of place. The child knows to focus on the joints. The child knew how to inflict damage.

A former ball player would already have some damage in the joints. These kicks would do him considerable damage.

Anonymous said...

He should already be out for good. Shouldn't have been there to begin with.

I hope Webster wins his lawsuit. The kid's parents knew he was violent and school officials knew he was violent. He shouldn't have even been in that school in the first place. He was and IS a danger to all the other children he comes in contact with, and NOT just a danger to the adults who are forbidden by law to exercise the punishment he really needed and deserved. Meds or no meds, he should be isolated and left for his parents (and people like Kit) to deal with, who, obviously never took his violent behavior seriously.

Kit's post sounds wonderful, caring and sweet as sugar, nonetheless is as a martyr;, like eating vanilla ice cream can get sickening sweet when you keep stuffing yourself on it. NOT the real world where one has to deal with these violent children all day everyday, and tolerate their nasty and criminal abuse from which there is no escape. That kid is lucky Webster only tried to restrain him.

Absolutely, Webster should be compensentated for his long term injuries, this is not a skinned knee or a hair pulling confrontation! I hope it becomes a casebook study and a school board rule of practice, that kids like this one aren't even allowed into public schools. I certainly wouldn't want one of MY kids exposed to him. Maybe THEN parents can learn how to take their kids to a professional when they need one, can control and teach their kids how to behave, and school boards can take some action to prevent these nasty little brats from running ramport over others with their violent mental disabilities by not allowing them into their schools in the first place; meanwhile, kick him and other juvenile deliquents like him OUT of their schools.

Let the parents and family courts deal with them. There are trained special ed teachers who come into the home to teach and deal with kids like this one, so let'em. There are also special schools for these kids. Schools are a place of learning and achieving an education, not a battleground for little brats to bully and physically attack others. Our school children are supposed to enjoy going to school, and the learning experience; NOT live in fear of being terrorized by the school sicko bully, same as teachers and staff should not have to tolerate these mentally disturbed bullies who disrupt their classes and schedules or their parents who won't cooperate with them.

Good luck Webster. You deserve it. For what it's worth, that's my opinion.

Anonymous said...

“It’s sort of like an angel-devil sort of thing,” said the 5-foot-10 Webster, who recently filed a notice of his intent to sue the city and says he must now wear braces on his right ankle and knee.

--He says it is Sort of like an angel-devil sort of thing. He is not saying it is an angel-devil situation or personality. It is only sort of like it, and he was only sort of like an angel-devil himself. "Sort of" stated twice. He also states that he is embarrassed. Present tense. He is aware that this is an embarrassing situation for him, but he is willing to pursue the suit despite how embarrassing it is for him. He is willing to put himself in a humiliating position for the prospect of getting money in the future. They say that everyone has a price, his is not too high, because there is no guarantee that he might get a good settlement.

On the other hand, I agree with Anon 8:39. It may be frivolous, but the lawsuit can go a long way to preventing these violent little kids from imposing their violence on other children. The mother stated that "he is much better now", therefore acknowledging that he was "bad" previously and by default, admitting she did nothing. Violent kids do not belong with other kids. What's with the karate chop anyway? Who taught him that? I suspect that the kid was growing up in an environment where the dad wants to have a "macho" kid at any expense, and he probably beats up on the wife too. He likes teaching his kid how to "defend" himself so begins teaching him to karate chop, take him to karate lessons, so he can be a little man, but never taught him restraint, or what it really means to defend yourself. That might explain the violent behavior for the little tyke. So Anon 8:39 - I am with you!

Maggie said...

"one of the kicks landed"--He's lying. The language is too passive to have been a real kick or a kick that caused any real harm. Maybe the kid kicked him, but it didnt cause any injury.

VLW said...

You've summed it up nicely! I agree.

VLW said...

If the martial arts teacher is reputable, this boy will be banned from further classes. I've known of students refused further instruction for lesser aggressive offenses.

My own (admittedly cursory) analysis of the educator's statements showed first person, past tense. It looked reliable to me. But apart from compensation for lost work time and medical expenses, I think his lawsuit is frivolous.

Anonymous said...

Webster’s lawyer, Andrew Siben of Bay Shore, LI, said school officials were repeatedly warned about Rodrigo but did not protect his client.
“This kid is clearly a tiny terror,” he said. “It’s sad that teachers like Mr. Webster are not offered protection from someone who can endanger other teachers and students.”

It appears that the man's attorney is not to convinced that his client was endangered. He indicated that teachers like Mr. Webster are not offered protection, not that Mr. Webster himself was not offered protection. He also indicated projected from "someone" who can endanger other teachers and students. He further distanced his client indicating that his client was not "endangered" himself. He stated "someone" could endanger them, not that Mr. Webster needed projectection from a child who endangered him. His attorney does not believe his client was endangered.

Anonymous said...

The boy’s mom added, “This is a terrible thing to say [about] a child.”
“To every mother, their child is an angel,” said Josefa Marcia da Silva, 33, of her son, now 4-foot-3 and 64 pounds. “I know that he has problems, but he doesn’t deserve to be called such names.”

The mother uses child to reference her son. She may be revealing that she has been abused, or maybe her son is being abused. It would not surprise me considering the bad behavior. She stated "this" is a terrible thing to say about a child. "This" being close, and "that" being distant. She probably has called her son similar things herself, maybe she has witnessed her husband call him things.

Anonymous said...

I believe the child had to be restrained because if he had turned on another child, then they would have blamed the teacher for not restraining the unruly student. I am an educator. Teachers are required to be all things to all types of children and all people for that matter. It's tough and unless you were there walking in this educators shoes, your reply should be "no comment" in my honest opinion.

Anonymous said...

I do not believe Webster is lying. I believe he has sustained a permanent injury from this violent little brat who shouldn't have been in a public school setting to begin with. It doesn't take much to damage a knee and this kid packed a powerful kick and knew exactly what he was doing, just like he'd been taught to do. Read one of the posts above, where a violent kid broke two ribs of another school employee. There are many more of these stories we never hear about.

I had a friend who was a high school teacher and died an early death as the result of a student bullying and threatening her. One day after class she found a note lying on her desk that read, "I'm going to kill you when you aren't looking". Talk about fear and panic! Her life became a total nightmare as she got more and more notes, even notes left on her windshield in the teacher's parking lot, he knew her car. During all the many months of this nightmare she got sick and was seeking medical and mental healath treatment.

All the notes were given to the principal, PO and to the school board. No one could determine who wrote them. Then a note on her front door, he knew where she lived. She was eventually able to change school districts and bought a new car. Another note on her door, I know you bought a new car. I know where you are. She sold her condo and moved. Another note on her new front door. She lived in fear of being alone. Long story short, the friend, at only age 52 died quickly of pancreatic cancer. Yes, that type cancer is nearly always terminal, but those of us who knew her and watched her suffer in fear of her killer KNEW that he hastened her death.

This child has already proven himself to be a menace to society. He has no respect for the authority of the adults over him while his parents teach and encourage him in his violent misbehavior, and he certainly wouldn't hesitate to bully and physically attack other children. Can the pros even help him? Only time will tell, but it certainly shouldn't be on the backs of the public school system.

I don't think Webster's language is too passive at all. What would you expect him to say, having been injured in such a way and the kid only 6 yrs old while he is a hefty former athelete? Of course he would be embarassed, but it's not exactly like he could go one on one with the kid!

Unknown said...

Small children can inflict serious damage if they act with malice anger ect an strike you in the right/wrong place...Ive watched nanny 911 its funny at times .An some of thease kids are spoiled an enabled to get away with terrible agressive behaveiour towards there Parents Sibblings an others...O T a man confessses to murder via Dr Phill http://news.yahoo.com/police-man-talked-dr-phil-confessing-213346425.html

Unknown said...

HOUSTON (AP) — A man accused of killing his ex-girlfriend in Houston and then driving hundreds of miles to dump her body in a West Texas oil field taped an interview about the case with the "Dr. Phil" show two days before confessing to investigators, police said Monday.

Mark Augustin Castellano, a 37-year-old computer technician, has been charged with murder in the Sept. 22 death of 31-year-old Michelle Warner.

Houston Det. Fil Waters said Castellano initially told investigators that Warner had run out on him and their 3-year-old son. Her family later reported her missing to police.

Castellano, who was staying with his son at his parents' home in Odessa in West Texas, had kept in contact with police and agreed to return to Houston on Sunday to speak with investigators. During a two-hour interview, Castellano told investigators he killed Warner after an argument in their apartment in which he grabbed her by the throat and apparently snapped her neck, Waters said.

Waters said Castellano also indicated he had taped an interview for the "Dr. Phil" show on Friday.

"I thought he was kidding, but it was the real deal," Waters said. "He talks to Dr. Phil, provides Dr. Phil as I understand it, with the same information he's been providing everyone else."

In a brief statement, Stacey Luchs, a spokeswoman for the "Dr. Phil" show said, "Mr. Castellano sat down for an interview with Dr. Phil in Texas just before his confession to law enforcement, late last week. Dr. Phil also conducted an interview with Ms. Warner's family for this show, which is currently scheduled to air on Thursday."

The statement did not say what Castellano talked about during his interview.

He is scheduled to have his initial court appearance on Tuesday. Court records did not list an attorney for him.

Waters said Castellano told investigators his son was in the apartment when he killed Warner but did not witness the slaying. Afterwards, Castellano drove his son to this parents' home before returning to Houston for Warner's body, the detective said. He put it in a plastic container, placed that in Warner's car and then drove back to Odessa.

"He spends a day and a half trying to figure out what he is going to do with Michelle. She, in the meantime, is in the backseat of the car, which is parked at his parents' house," Waters said. He added that Castellano's parents didn't know Warner's body was in the car outside their home.

Eventually, Castellano decided to take the body to nearby Midland, where he dumped it in a ditch in an oil field, covering it with some dirt.

"His comment was, 'I didn't really try to hide her. I'm surprised you all haven't found her already,'" Waters said.

Odessa police and FBI agents found the body. An autopsy is pending to confirm Warner's identity and determine the cause of death.

"Had he not confessed, we would still be stuck," Waters said. "His timeline was plausible. We had no physical evidence. We had our suspicions."

The couple had a history of fighting, he said.


Anonymous said...

Oh Good Lord. I don't see any indication that this child has ever been abused! If anything, it would be the other way around.

I also don't see where Webster's atty is distancing himself from him or that he doesn't believe that his client was endangered. For pete's sakes, the bully/brat seriously injured his client's knee!

This little brat is a juvenile deliquent with parents who encourage him in it and then make excuses for him. I hope they too get sued and not just the City of New York. They knew and they should pay.

MizzMarple said...


My sincere apologies for being off topic here, but I found something that I think definitely needs your expertise in Statement Analysis.

It is the case of Morgan Ingram. I do not recall seeing it on your Statement Analysis site, so I am posting some info about it here.

Morgan's mother has set up a "Blog" -- the posts on the blog were started on August 2, 2012 -- which is 1 year prior to Morgan being "stalked."

Morgan was stalked for 4 months, and in Dec of 2011 she died under mysterious circustances. Her family has been posting events on the one year anniversary of the occurance each day, and will to do so until December.

The link is : http://morganingram.com/wordpress/?p=389

There is also more info at WS.

I am trying to apply the info I have learned here at your site on Statement Analysis when I read this blog about Morgan -- but it would be even more helpful to have an Expert weigh in ! Also, I think the posters here would be able to help in the Analysis as well !

This is a strange case, in my opinion.

Thank You.

Lis said...

As soon as a parent says "I know he has problems," you know that the child is completely out of control.

"I know he has problems" is usually followed by "but" and the parent states their belief that, despite their child's "problems", he and they should not be required to abide by any limitations or pay any consequences.

Lis said...

Possibly a lawsuit was likely filed because it is the only avenue left to force this child's parents to acknowledge his problem and do something about it.

MizzMarple said...

Here is a sample from the blog on Morgan Ingram : Link : http://morganingram.com/wordpress/?p=536

Her stalking has been going on for 11 days now, and even though I may call it a quiet night, we don’t really sleep well. Our guard has been raised and we are becoming, what the Sheriff’s tell us later, is called “hyper-vigilant.” It’s like when you sleep in a new place that you are uncomfortable in, every noise no matter how small or slight has added significance now. We lie in bed and instead of kissing and saying, “good night honey” we talk about what we are going to do if we should hear a rock against the window. Who’s going out the front door? Who’s going out the back door? Mag lights on, Mag lights off? How we are the two of us going to corner him? We actually have no idea who he is, or if it’s even a he. We have so far never caught the slightest glimpse. If it were not for his actual footprints, up against our house in front of our windows, we would be dealing with that small doubt – we have had so many theories from our friends that maybe the windows could make noises on their own with temperature changes, or it could be bats with faulty sonar that smack into windows – however none of those leave Etnie skater shoe footprints on the ground.

Morgan still feels safer sleeping in our closet on the floor, and tonight there was no noise on the closet window…it was a quiet night.


I find it "strange" that this young lady would be sleeping on the floor in her parent's closet -- because she is terrified of this "stalker".

BUT -- Morgan had a dog -- which a dog is great protection !

Again, sorry for the off topic ... but this case is interesting.

Maggie said...

Anon--If someone is truly assaulted, they will say "and then he kicked me in the knee" "he punched me in the face, etc.".
This man is claiming to need knee braces and suffer emotional trauma. "One kick landed"--There is no "kicker" in this sentence, yet he is claiming this "kicker" caused extremem physical/mental damage. So, did SOMEONE kick him or did the kick just "land" on it's own? My guess is tha he was kicked but that it did not cause injury.
As someone who has taken karate, I will say that a karate move done right can injure, but from the sound of it, with the gym teacher "trying" to grab his wrists, it would be impossible for him to get into the right karate position to do any serious damage plus it would depend on the gym teacher standing quite still when receiving the kick. Even then, I doubt with the kid weighing 50 lbs he could have popped his knee especially given the gym teacher was grabbing at his wrists there is no way the kid could have been able to have the right form to make that kind of powerful kick to actually pop a knee. Plus, this guy implies the knee popping kick was one of several kicks--it is even less likely the kid could have delivered multiple successive powerful kicks.

Maggie said...

A lot of karate is balance (a lot of it too has to do with center of gravity too like in Shotokan Karate the power of the punches and kicks have to do with lowering the center of gravity which you can't do if someone that much bigger is grabbing at your wrists)--if someone is knocking you off balance, it's going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible to deliver punches or kicks that are powerful. I would say that if this hulking gym teacher was grabbing at the kid's wrists, there is just no way he delivered a knee-popping kick.

Maggie said...

Off topic: In the newspaper today, there is a local case in court right now where the accused shooter told detectives shortly after the shooting "I didn't shoot her. I swear to God, I didn't shoot her." But then when detectives left the room, they have him on tape mumbling to himself "why did you shoot her?"
So now, defense and prosecution are arguing over whether he was addressing himself when he said "why did YOU shoot her?" or whether he was addressing his brother (in his head) when he said "why did YOU shoot her?"
Anyway, thought of you Peter--seemed like a case for statement analysis!

Anonymous said...

Maggie, with all due respect; this kid could have kicked in rapid succession, hard, over and over whether being restrained or not. I don't find anything untruthful in Webster's statements about that.

I do believe however, that going to mental health therapy won't help the situation at this point, unless he's just trying to make his case bigger and better. Websters' an adult, get over it. No point in having nightmares, the jitters (or whatever) over it. I don't blame him for filing his lawsuit but that on-going emotional thing-a-ma-jig part does seem a little bit much to me. Duh. His injuries are more physical than mental.

Maggie said...

Anon--I respect your opinion. 50 lbs. is not much in the weight department--I believe his kicking power is limited, if restrained it is more limited. The kid might've gotten in a decent kick but I don't believe he popped his knee. Just my opinion though.

Unknown said...

Med fraud comp sue is rife in America as a former sportsman he probably received injuries.Footballs a copntact sport.Exsagerate one of thease injuries with a complacent medical injury specialist big compensation check from the taxpayers via schoolboard could be well worth lieing for if your that way inclined...Not saying thats whats happening but its a possability..

Anonymous said...

Hi Florida.

Anonymous said...

Another out-of-control little monster in the making with brain dead parents.

MissUnderstood said...

MizzMarple, I started reading from the begining, I haven't gotten too far, but I will continue. I'm a bit confused though. It is her mother writing the blog, correct? Is she trying to write it in present tense? Like her headline is "Date - 10th Day of Stalking". So then is she writing in present tense for that particular day, or is she just supposed to be recalling what happened? Her tense seems to go back and forth. I'm not saying she's lying, I'm just confused, because I know in SA, past tense is from memory, and present tense is not. Does it make a difference, if the person is purposely telling it in present tense?

Unknown said...

Anyone unfortunate enough to have a child sit behind you in an aeroplane knows they can pack a kIck like a mule .

MissUnderstood said...

Here is a sample of what I mean:

8.16.2011 * Today was Morgan’s birthday –she turned 20. This morning when she woke up, I asked her if she would like french toast or eggs-in-a-hole (2 of her favorites), for her birthday breakfast. She giggles and chooses french toast, but says she wants her daddy’s french toast. Morgan loves his french toast.

BostonLady said...

This is OT but somewhat along the lines of this discussion. California has banned gay to straight therapy. Whether you agree with this type of therapy or not, to ban it???? This is coming from the same state that banned toys from Happy Meals. And on and on. Where will this end? More and more they are allowing the government (state) to dictate what they can and cannot practice or do. I find this very frightening. What about a patient's right to privacy?


California bans gay-to-straight therapy

Legislation prohibiting a form of therapy aimed at changing a minor's sexual orientation from gay to straight — the first law of its kind in the nation — was signed by California's governor.

Anonymous said...

Well I'll declare BL. That's all they ever needed in the first place. Well not entirely. First they need to turn to god THEN to therapy.

Anyhow, that's a big leap! Who the heck is the state to tell a parent they can't take their minor child for therapy to at least TRY to straighten out their confused sexual orientation. Since God didn't make any mistakes, then it is THEY who are sadly mistaken. Surely that's not legal is it?

Anonymous said...

possie, no point in jumping to conclusions and implying Webster is lying when there will be medical records that substantiates his injuries, wouldncha think?

I do agree however, these little 50# monster brats can kick like a mule and do just as much damage if kicked in the right spot and this little devil knew exactly where that spot was too!

Anonymous said...

Off topic:

5 year old April Jones missing; 46 year old Arrested for suspected kidnapping.


Anonymous said...

BL, from what I've read, it's only been banned for minors. I believe the state has a role to play in protecting children from psychological abuse as well as physical abuse, making this is a rightful exercise of its power in line with its responsibilities.

Consenting adults can still engage in this type of therapy.

Maggie said...

The gay-to-straight therapy sounds psychologically abusive. Why should the state want to have to pay for loads of therapy down the road for the psychological complexes and scars that kind of therapy would cause most participants? Also, if there is no proof that it even works, why should the state pay? The catch 22 is that even were there proof it works (which I do not believe possible) the state would have to adopt an illegal stance whereby they were backing prejudice towards gays if they allowed that therapy.
God does not disapprove of gays. At least if one believes Jesus was his messenger, because Jesus said nothing against gays.

Anonymous said...

I agree. You summed it right up! You will be amazed at the amount of damage a kid can do. Believe me, I know. A three year old head butted me and did damage. I had a knot and headache for about a week.

BostonLady said...

I don't know if it works but if you look at any kind of therapy, you can say it's harmful to try to change someone. My point is the government does not belong in these types of decisions. This is a slippery slope of government telling everyone what is good for them and taking choice from us. What about not being able to buy a 16 oz sugar drink in NY? Do you really want government telling you what you can and cannot drink? And if it is minors, the parents are giving consent. Do we want to take that away from the parents?

Not trying to preach doom and gloom but this appears to be opening the flood gates.

Anonymous said...

Maggie, with all due respect; Jesus was not only our messenger from God, He was also the Son of God, was from God, and IS God, sent to us in the flesh having returned to the right hand of God. He is the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost all in one. (Let's put it this way; say you have a husband, his name is Leroy. He is someones friend, someones father, someones son, someones husband. Do you all call him friend, son, father, husband? No you call him Leroy. His name is Leroy).

I think you need to read the Bible before you go making judgments for Jesus. I think you must not know what the scriptures say about man lying with man, woman lying with woman, and "woe to those who put the children through the fire". God's word is infallible, "sharper than a two-edged sword, does not return to him void", and not to be taken lightly.

ANY parent has the right to take their child to church, sunday school or therapy if they feel they need or want their child to learn more than just the dirty perverted life the media and many others are leading them into while convincing them they have homosexual tendencies even while in grade school.

They also have the right to try to keep them from the eternal jaws of hell; and they are cheating them out of life eternal if they don't. This I might add, is what is wrong with our children today. They aren't being taught about God and HIS precepts.

Think what you like, but there will be no sin allowed in heaven and into eternal life. I think there are going to be multitudes of those who thought their sin would be alright with God. Not so fast. There are many many scriptures warning us all about "the wages of sin is death" and then the judgment. "Teach thy son in the way he shall go when he is young and he will not depart from it when he is old". That is a direct Biblical quote. No offense meant, but I wouldn't be so quick to undermine the Word of God and lightly speak for Jesus if I were you.

MissUnderstood said...

Here is an interesting article, with lots of quotes from the mother. I didn't realize her cause of death was questionable. The first I heard of this was from MizzMarple and started reading the blog posts, from the 1st day of stalking. I originally assumed her stalker murdered her, and it was known. I'd really like to know why the mother is recalling her daughters last 4 months in present tense. Also, if you read the sample I provided above, I don't know of any 20 year old woman who giggles at the thought of her daddy's french toast. I know that might sound mean, but I'm just being honest. Obviously there is sensitivity due to the cause of death, I'm not sure how much that applies to these blog posts. I hope that Peter will be able to look at it as well.


Maggie said...

BostonLady--I do agree with you wholeheartedly about the dangers of the Nanny State. I mean--it is happening again this year in gym that my son is being expected to wear a monitor for 9 days (day and night) that records his activity level/time sleeping and awake/calories burned/steps taken/heart rate--along with that they are expected to record in writing all of their activities for the 9 days (they enclose a list of pretty much every activity they are supposed to record having done including time spent at religious services!) WHY?? WHY in the world is the government seeking this information?!?! We do attend church but I consider that none of the school's or government's business! I will have to sign him off from wearing this monitor again this year and probably he will be the only kid in the class again who gets signed off. It is mindblowing! (He doesn't want to wear the monitor so it's a no brainer signing him off luckily.) I guess I agree that th3e government shouldn't be able to regulate therapy--that could be a very dangerous slope, and I absolutely agree with you that it is already a dangerous trend with all of their invasions of privacy and even scarier how most people don't question it!

Anonymous said...

I actually think that a teacher finally stepped up and did something extremely worthy of respect. He protected the other children while trying to handle an out-of-control child. His level of self-control was miraculous after being bitten, kicked twice, and still held onto his presence of mind. That kick to the ankle caused a fracture. The kid broke his ankle. A "pop" in the knee may very well require surgery. IMHO,job security and function, financial pressures from health care along with pain management may all be contributing to his stress. I can't see a huge guy like this crying foul unless some very serious damage was done. Let's give the teacher a huge benefit of the doubt... please.

Maggie said...

Anon--I appreciate your insights about Jesus. (Although I don't believe there is any mention against woman lying with woman in the Bible.) All I am saying is that Jesus did not speak out against homosexuality but I understand you are saying God did and you are talking about the mystery of Jesus's being and how he is not distinct from God but rather part of God and that is very wise.
I am a practicing Catholic, but I do not believe that homosexuals are sinful, and I don't believe they will be punished. I do not believe that they will be thrown in the eternal jaws of hell.
Even if you believe that homosexuals are sinful, Jesus came to earth to encourage us to be merciful to others. Jesus was a healer who healed those whom others thought were "beyond hope" ie. (they were already dead, they were dumb and mute, they were possessed by demons, etc.). I believe in my heart Jesus was a powerful healer. But nowhere did he "heal" a homosexual. I am just saying.
I respect your views, but I encourage you to see that Jesus withheld judgement on others, seeking to heal, but not seeking to turn them into what he wants them to be or recoiling from a person's ailment(s).
Jesus loved unconditionally. I just don't understand why gay people would be thrown into jaws of hell.
What about a gay couple who adopts a child who otherwise would have no parents and they love the child and raise the child to be a healthy and happy adult. Would Jesus not smile on this, would he not approve that they had helped an orphan, or would he throw them into hell?

Anonymous said...

"My poor son"

Perhaps he should have taught his son to behave. A displaced knee cap, or any knee injury is serious!
His ankle was probably just bruised. Emotional damage could have been a result of cajoling by others that a small boy could actually do damage to a large person...especially an all-star football player.

What if his teacher had been in a wheelchair? Would that be different?

MissUnderstood said...

Webster was accompanying Rodrigo and other students to the cafeteria for lunch when the boy started horseplaying, the teacher told The Post.

Webster said that he chided Rodrigo, but that the kid started kicking him.

“I tried to hold his wrists, and he began biting me,’’ Webster said. “I took him to the principal’s office, and he kicked me in the ankle, and one kick landed right on my knee. I felt a pop.


Something happened, but not to the extent that the teacher is portraying, IMO.

Who did the boy start horseplaying with?

The teacher tried to hold the boy's wrists, but couldn't?

The boy started biting him. Did he stop biting him? Were bite marks left?

"he kicked me in the ankle, and one kick landed right on my knee". "He kicked me" sounds like one kick. He was kicking me or he kept kicking me or he repeatedly kicked me or he kicked me 500 times would be multiple, so how many times did the boy kick him in the ankle, and how did the kick(s?) to the ankle land right on his knee?

Obviously, the mother knows her son has some type of issues, to openly admit it. I feel this incident is being overly exaggerated though. I don't think violence is acceptable behavior, especially for children. I am not making excuses for the boy, although I strongly feel this was exaggerated by the teacher, and maybe the school, in fear of the way the situation was handled?

Maggie said...

Just wanted to add one more thing: I do feel bad for some gay people. I do not understand why someone would be gay, although I do feel it is something that most gay people are born that way. Still, it is hard for me to understand, because I'm not gay. I think that gay people live a difficult l"ife for many reasons--one reason is that it is not accepted by many people. Also, it is probably a lot easier to be straight. BUT--I do not understand how someone can be "turned straight". If someone tried to "turn me gay" it wouldn't work. At all. Not even a little. So...I read an article about the gay therapy and one of it's goals is to "maximize heterosexual potential" and I say THIS IS BAD! Why? What woman would like to marry a man whose "heterosexual potential" has needed to be "maximized"? The words betray what is actually going on--the hope is not that the gay people will actually be turned straight but that they will achieve some "heterosexual potential". How horrible for the woman the gay guy "turned kinda straight" marries as well as any kids they have!!! This is just wrong! Just my opinion.

Lemon said...

“It’s sort of like an angel-devil sort of thing,” said the 5-foot-10 Webster,"
It's - what is 'it'?
sort of - repeated, sensitive

“[Rodrigo] looks like an angel, but then, all of a sudden, that halo turns into horns. It’s been a nightmare. It’s embarrassing. It’s humiliating.”
all of a sudden - Hobs, help! what is this? It sounds like story telling.
that - distancing
turns - present tense
It's - What is 'it'?

Lemon said...

Jorge Carpio, 44, scoffed: “The lawsuit is totally absurd. How could my little boy do so much damage? My poor son.”
totally- qualifier
my little boy - takes possession
My poor son - takes possession, change of language. Why does 'little boy' change to 'poor son'? Is he a 'little boy' when connected to 'damage' but 'poor' 'son' when related to the father?

Lemon said...

The boy’s mom added, “This is a terrible thing to say [about] a child.”
“To every mother, their child is an angel,” said Josefa Marcia da Silva, ... “I know that he has problems, but he doesn’t deserve to be called such names.”

'this' is close
'a child' - not my, she does not take possession like the father does
'child' - repeated, use can be associated with prior abuse
'To every mother...' she does not say herself in this, so we may not either.
'I know' is straightforward, 1st person
'that' distancing?
'he' - doesn't use her son's name, he is 'he'
doesn't - in the negative, sensitive
'such' - extra wording, sensitive
Why would the name calling be 'close' but her son himself 'distanced'?

Lemon said...

“I tried to hold his wrists, and he began biting me,’’ Webster said. “I took him to the principal’s office, and he kicked me in the ankle, and one kick landed right on my knee. I felt a pop.’’

tried - past tense, indicates attempted but failed
began biting - started, incomplete, was it continued?
one kick landed - passive
right - extra information
I felt a pop. - where? We aren't told, so we can't assume.

Lemon said...

from the lawyer:
“This kid is clearly a tiny terror,” he said. “It’s sad that teachers like Mr. Webster are not offered protection from someone who can endanger other teachers and students.”

'teachers like Mr. Webster' - not Mr. Webster, only 'teachers like' Mr. Webster.
'other' teachers- distancing from his client. He does not say the tiny terror endangered his client, Mr. Webster.

MizzMarple said...

Hi MissUnderstood,

Yes, Morgan's mother is writing the blog. The tense is very confusing as well as the "purpose" of the blog. She writes about what happened "each day" a year ago -- which is the 4 months prior to Morgan's death -- and she continues adding entries each day.

Good catch about the "giggling" about the "french toast", and I agree -- what 20 year old would "giggle" at that ? A child, probably, but a grown woman, no.

Also, it does not appear that this "stalker" has been found. And that is one thing that raised "red flags" for me.

There is a section on Morgan's case at WebSleuths, but you have to be a member to read it there, as they have now moved it to the "basement". The police reports are also located there.

I hope that Peter can do some analysis on some of these entries that are on the blog -- I think these entries warrant Statement Anslysis because In My Opinion, there is somewhere -- and I think Peter's Analysis will definitely point out the inconsistencies, and the "truth" and/or "lies."

Anonymous said...

She was more than likely trying to log events after they happened in a short version describing the events prior to the death of her loved one.

Sleeping in the closet of her parent's room would have meant there were no windows through which an intruder to enter, through things at, or shoot through.

And, her daughter may have saw no way out of the continual stalking and decided to commit suicide as it would be severely depressing.

It's not unusal for motion light to go on and off due to wind, branches, etc. It is unusal to find footprints, however. A man recently said he had been followed and even found a bussiness card in his wallet;he also found footprints outside his window.

Anonymous said...

Lemon, some things are assumed to connect to each other even when one sentence ends and another begins...'right on my knee. I felt a pop.'

He felt a pop on his knee!
The biting ended, of course, as he could not bite and walk to the principal's office at the same time (should be a no-brainer)

Anonymous said...

...It’s been a nightmare. It’s embarrassing. It’s humiliating.”

IT sounds like story telling.

It's - What is 'it'?


Anonymous said...

If you are not or have been an educator, please type "no comment" and move on. You are clueless, period. The End

Anonymous said...

Billie Dunn is on this program.

Nanna Frances

Lemon said...

Assumptions R US,
You haven't been around these parts very long, have you?

Anonymous said...

Billie Dunn is on this program. It will be on again tonight at 10:00 PM CDT.

Nanna Frances

Tania Cadogan said...

Tee hee ^5 Lemons

Tania Cadogan said...

For those of you who believe in god, who believe god made man in his image and god never makes a mistake explain the following:

Children born with severe disabilities.
Children who die young and painfully of interestig diseases.
Children who are born intersex ( hermaphrodite was the old term)
Children who are born gay, lesbian, bisexual, transexual and heterosexual.

Those of you who belive homosexuality or being anything other than straight is sinful and thus must be corrected need to do some serious soul searching.
If 'they' can be corrected from their 'lifestyle choice' then the implication is then that heterosexuality is a lifestyle choice and can also be corrected.

People are who they are.
We don't choose to be heterosexual same as they don't choose to be homosexual same as those who are born intersex (both male and female)
Although society today is more accepting of alternate lifestyles being anything other than straight ( normal) can and often does lead to a harder life with insualts, taunts, threats and even death simply because they are seen as different, a threat to the norm,

I wonder those of you who say homosexuals. lesbians, transgender and bisexual are sinners who must see the light and become straight, how many of you would turn down help if they offered it to you.
How many of you have been treated by the homosexual community when in hospital. at the dentist, the doctor, how many of you have gay friends you don't know about, how many of you have worked alongside gays.

If god makes no mistakes, we are all made in his image and a child is a gift from god then god made them gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender.
Since god made these people maybe god made them for a reason, to teach understanding, forebearance, equality, nonjudgementalism.

What it boils down to is either god doesn't make mistakes, he makes everyone of us and the homosexual community is all part of godand thus be loved and accepted as one of god's creations like anyone else, or, god was having a real bad day and he got a bit careless when creating a baby (what with so many millions being born each day and no computerised production line) and the occasional oopsie slipped past quality control.
Since these are god's mistakes, they are imperfect, they cannot be counted as one of god's creatures made in his image and must be promptly dispatched back to god forthwith for disposal in the incinerator, after all we cannot allow defects to taint his name now can we.

No doubt those who believe the latter can get ideas from the spanish inquisition, the death camps in WW2, the good old medieval period on suitable methods to correct the sinners or, even easier remove them completely so the earth can then be as perfect as believers can make it.
However there is then a new problem.
What about those who worship god slightly differently, who attend a different church or even worship god under a different name?
They too must be corrected and if all else fails dispatched to god along with a brief note explaining the fault.
Once there is just on religion left ( whoever had the most believers. precreated faster than others or who had better weapons) will they then start to look for sinners amongst theor own, someone didn't dress correctly, weren't pious enough, had a pet, grew better crops, avoided being hit by a tornado when their neighbor didn't, practised medicine, looked old, had some minor deformity such as a wart.

Be careful what you wish for my friends, today it's the gay community, tommorow it could be YOU.

Be tolerant, be understanding, be loving, be patient, treat others as you wish to be treated and you will go far and expeience the joys of being alive.

Be intolerant, be hateful, be bigoted and biased, be inpatient, treat others as you wouldn't wish to be treated and you will lead lonely and miserable lives, unloved and uncared for.

Big hugs to you all :)

Anonymous said...

Maggie, I cannot answer all your questions regarding homosexuality, their good works and any missing teachings of Jesus as he walked and talked among men, or how they or any of us will fare in the judgment who have not believed and followed the Word of God, (I believe very badly and without excuse according to the Word of God, that being Jesus), which IS inclusive of Jesus' teachings throughout the Bible. I know that the Bible has not been rewritten for homosexuals or for any of us, and there are many warnings concerning all of our sins including homosexuality. Yes, we do have a choice. We have a choice in everything we do. To say that we don't is to blame God for the nature of our birth and the wrongs that we willingly commit, when God is not the author of evil or confusion.

I can tell you this, the teachings of Jesus are throughout the Old Testament, the Psalms & the Proverbs and not just in the New Testament, and not just as someone else might see it or believe it. Once you understand and realize that God and Jesus are the same entity and not separate, you see many things differently. Among Jesus' teachings he said "I and my father are one", "I am the beginning and the end, the alpha and omega", "I am from the foundations of the earth, forevermore and forever shall be" "there is none other", and so on. There is no separation of Jesus from God. They are one and the same and there is none other.

We have to understand that we have not been made privy to all of Jesus' New Testament teachings while he was on this earth. WE have been allowed those books that are presently in the Bible, many are missing, referred to as the lost sea scolls, while others are being retained by the catholic church; they say 'for interpretation'. Did you know that it was only in about the 1200's AD that the catholic church, who had possession of the Bible, allowed those chapters we presently have to be reproduced and released, and it was not until several centuries later that they allowed their own followers to possess copies?

Prior to that the Bible was withheld from the masses and was read from only by the catholic priests. What surprises me is that they left some of the scriptures in the Bible that they did; such as where Jesus said, "call no man father, your father is in heaven", yet they have their flock bowing the knee to their priests, repenting to them and calling them father when no mortal man has the power to justify or forgive anyones sins. I am not condemming the catholic church, I am saying Jesus said "none commeth to the father but by me, your father is in heaven". Again he said "you have not because you ask not, you call not on the name of the one I sent to you".

Oh well, just giving you a little Bible history, not chastising the catholics or anyone else. I'm not attempting to judge anyone, I have my own judgment to worry about. Alls I'm saying is that we would do well to study and practice all of Jesus' teachings throughout the Bible and not just those that we interpret to mean what we want them to mean, or think they mean, or someone else said it meant. There's more, much more. There are no contradictions and no confusion in it. You (we) have to understand what you (we) are reading, who said what, when and where, and tie it together; not just run off with one or two scriptures thinking we've got it covered, when there are others speaking indepth that fully explain, leading to no misunderstanding. THEN it becomes clear as a bell.

One last thought; did you know that according to old Jewish Law, this little six year old boy who attacked Webster and others in his demonic rage, would have been set outside the camp and stoned to death for being unruly and beyond control? Yep. Sure would have.

MissUnderstood said...

There apparently is a window in the closet:

Thursday, August 11th –The 10th day of Morgan’s stalking

Morgan tells us in the morning she has decided that she will just send me text messages from her cell phone whenever she hears a noise on the closet window (she is still sleeping in my closet), this way nobody can hear her call out to me in the room.

Anonymous said...

Hobnob, I see you have written a well thought out post, labored over it, even almost entirely without typo mistakes. A lot of your time and concentration went into this post and for that, hats off. Everything you said 'sounds' good.

You make many excellent points, but you overlook just ONE big factor. You do not realize or recognize that there is a SATAN on this earth. He is the ruler of the princes of darkness in great principalities and is the prince of the air. He has great power in his evil and deceit, even appearing as an angel of light to deceive even those who believe in God, and HATES the name of Jesus. He is sitting on the front row in every church of every denomination. He has the whole world deceived, including (AND ESPECIALLY) in religious circles and denominations.

He has everyone believing that everything that is wrong on this earth, GOD did it, GOD caused it, GOD allowed it, it is all GOD's fault; "see, there is no God, if there was he wouldn't allow these things". The war is a spiritual war, between God and satan, the angels and the demons, and it is for the souls of man. Meaning all of us. Satan is God's enemy and is ALL of humanity's enemy, beginning in the Garden of Eden and thereafter accelerating his power over humanity.

It is SATAN who performs every one of those many transgressions, evils, deformaties and sicknesses you outline above and many more. No, God did NOT make any mistakes. You (and others who follow in your beliefs, or just some of them) need to understand that God can make no mistakes, he is pure, holy, divine, without sin, spot or blemish; yet can turn it all into good. He loves us so. He looks at us ad cries for our suffering and the suffering of his children, which we all are. He sent to us a way back if we just follow and hold on.

If you want to REALLY be fair to yourself, then read the Bible with an open mind, REALLY read it. You will then see and understand exactly what is going on here on this earth and how it came into being and what the end result will be. You are a smart woman, Hobnob, and you need to AT LEAST give yourself this great gift of understanding and knowledge. You OWE it to yourself. God bless.

MizzMarple said...

Hi MissUnderstood,

Yes, there is a window in the closet -- and this is what I find odd is that the "stalker" was throwing rocks at the window when she was sleeping in the closet.

Have you gotten to the section of the blog that shows "alleged" photos of the "stalker" when the police officers were leaving ?

Here is the link : http://morganingram.com/wordpress/?p=845

And the strange part of this is Morgan slept through all of it -- and she wasn't sleeping in the closet that night -- she was sleeping in her room.

Strange ... very strange, in my opinion !

Anonymous said...

If God doesn't make mistakes, why do people feel the need to change the sexual orientation of there child. God made them that way, there for, it must be the way he wanted them!

Anonymous said...

Excellent answer to Hobnob.

May I respectfully suggest that in order to understand God and the Bible one must believe that the Book is His inspired word.

MissUnderstood said...

Hi MizzMarple,

I ended up reading the entire blog, right up to today.

I do find the whole thing very strange.

I'm not a member at WS, so I can't read there, unless I register obviously.

I did find something on justicequest.net that I was able to read. I've found that we are not the only ones that find all of this strange. I don't know if you have to register at JQ, but you can at least read others opinions.


I think the purpose of her mother writing the blog, is because she wants the case reopened?

MissUnderstood said...


I meant to say - I didn't read all of the comments, I only read a handful of them. I know the mother responds A LOT, so I am going to read the comments as well. Although, I believe comments have to be approved on her blog, so I assume there aren't any too "questioning" of her or her story.

Anonymous said...

Anon @ 8:35, many have disputed, mocked, scorned and disbelieved that the Bible is the Word of God until after they read it and conscienciously searched out it's meanings and found the evidence they were searching for, for THEMSELVES. So, as it is with God, it is impossible not to find YOURSELF in the Bible, no matter what you thought or believed.

This includes scientists, atheists, and many highly degreed individuals who initially thought it was ridiculous, how could this one book be from what we call 'a God', arguing to the end that it was written by man, or many, and could have many meanings, twists and turns. Thank God some of them begin to have the wisdom, or maybe it was a tug from God's heart, to read it for themselves as they certainly didn't believe it before they read it. The trouble was, they hadn't read it.

One does not have to believe that the Bible is God's inspired Word when they begin to read it. It pierces to the heart. IFF they truly ARE seekers of truth and knowledge. There is some strong stuff in that book! But God searches out the heart. God said that His word would not return to Him void, that means empty, that means it produces the results that HE intended it to produce. You see, man is not smarter than God.

There is NO WAY man (wo-man) can sit with the Bible and sincerely endeavor to find out for themselves if there really is a God, where is He, who is He, why are we in this quandary on earth, why doesn't God do something about it, who is Jesus, where is He, when is He coming back? Are you kidding me, did He really come into this life through an immaculate virgin birth? Is heaven or hell really real? Where are these angels and where is satan and all these demons you talk about? Or is it all just a big bunch of hooey only believed by fools, women, children, convicts on death row and religious scamming hucksters? Why then, do some go this way and some go that way? Because there is a SATAN on this earth who roars about like a thief in the night seeking whom he may destroy.

And because many don't really believe, or they never knew or either didn't believe, that Jesus said "take heed that you follow no man lest you both fall into the ditch". "Follow me, I am the truth, the light and the way". "None cometh to the father but by me". "He that hath an ear to hear, let him hear". "There is no other name given by heaven or earth whereby man might be saved". There are many priests and ministers who do not really believe the Bible or God's teachings, otherwise they would have a Godly fear of God and would not live the way they do. There are many who believe that just the one verse John 3:16 will save them. But that is not entirely so.

Jesus did not say "whosoever believeth on me should not perish but have eternal life", not in the way they THINK HE did. But they believe they got it covered just by saying "I believe in Jesus, John 3:16". Oh? Then they need to read the REST of the scriptures, because if they REALLY believed in Jesus then they would keep his commandments and follow his teachings. What He actually said was "whosoever believeth on me SHOULD not perish but have eternal life", he did not say they WOULD not perish, he said they SHOULD not. Even the devils believe and tremble at the name of Jesus.

All of these things are carefully explained beginnig in the first chapter of the Book of Genesis, where Jesus identifies who he is, and throughout the entire Bible; as is every other question known to man! There is no escaping the infallible Word of God once one diligently starts to search it out for themselves; it is THEN they begin to have an open eye, ear and mind. IFFF they really want to know.

It is when one begins to SEE that the Word of God IS His Word, it IS the truth, and will take God at His Word, that one begins to understand God and the Bible, which truly IS the inspired Word of God. Thank you for your kind response.

MissUnderstood said...


TIngram on October 1, 2012 at 9:29 pm

Not really sure what police officer reports you are referring to because I have never seen any. She did not have a prescription for Amitriptyline –she had an old prescription, and we found a bottle from 2009 with 12 pills still in it, but she had not taken it in over and year and 1/2, and Dr. Kurtzman and the Sheriff’s were told that. In addition her old amitriptyline was originally prescribe by Children’s Hospital for chronic headaches and pain at the lowest amount you can take 10 mg. Then as she got a little older Dr. Lonnie Zeltzer from UCLA (Director, Pediatric Pain Program, Professor of Pediatrics, Anesthesiology, Psychiatry and Biobehavioral Sciences David Geffen School of Medicine at UCLA, 22-464 MDCC, 10833 LeConte Ave., LA, CA, 90095-1752 310-825-0731; FAX 310-794-2104 http://www.mattel.medsch.ucla.edu/pedspain, http://www.wholechildla.org & http:// childpain.org) decided Morgan should take 25 mg per day –this was not for depression this was for her headaches and stomach pain that she had after being exposed to Carbon Monoxide.

After Morgan was 18 she decided she didn’t want take medications anymore and between yoga, meditation, eating right, juicing every morning, and then also going through the Hyperbaric Chamber treatment in Basalt she was actually able to get on top of her pain (Morgan had been exposed to Carbon Monoxide and that had switched her sympathetic nervous system and her parasympathetic nervous systems so her pain was caused by what you might refer to as the fight or flight being turned on all the time which caused her to have intense pain at times). Now that she was on top of her pain and feeling great she was able to participate in ballet rock climbing, biking, etc. All the things she couldn’t before. Morgan was a fighter, she never gave up and worked extremely hard to live her life the way she wanted to, and not the way someone else wanted her to.

As far as Gabapentin goes she did not have epilepsy –this was prescribed by Dr. Zeltzer as a prophylaxis for hyperalgesia (in case she felt an acute pain attack coming on she would take one and wait a minute then take another and then finally 3 and that would keep her from having to go to the ER). We had a bottle of these in our room but she very rarely took them so I always tried to keep 3 in a little pill minder in the car for her just in case. This was not found in Morgan’s tox results although I was pretty amazed she wasn’t taking them from the stress the stalker was causing her. Dr. Zeltzer said that 75 % of her patients like Morgan would not have been able to survive the stress and they would have been hospitalized with acute pain. A good book to read about this is Vienna’s Waiting (A teenage girl’s battle with pain) by Georgia Huston. Someone like Morgan that fights her way through major pain attacks, learns how to play the piano, knit, crochet, play the ude, finish up 2 years of college, take thousands of pictures, enjoy her animals, loves to bake in the kitchen, travel by herself to Hawaii, San Francisco, LA and work with kids is pretty amazing to me. Maybe that’s because I’m her mom and of course mom’s are supposed to feel that way so maybe I’m wrong and maybe most 20 year olds do all these things.

MissUnderstood said...

TIngram on October 2, 2012 at 8:10 am

If you read the tox results you will see there was no alcohol, no illegal drugs, nothing except amitriptyline, flexiral (both considered date rape drugs by our government), along with 4 + other date rape drugs that were detected. Also, there were no pills in her stomach. Morgan was not taking amitriptyline –she had stopped taking it for pain over a year and a half before her death. I told the Sheriff that I kept a small silver pill holder on the dashboard of the car with 3 gabapentin, and one adivan in it in case she felt an attack coming on –this was prescribed to take in this amount before an attack by the ER doctor as well as Dr. Zeltzer from UCLA. She never took gabapentin on a daily basis ever –she didn’t like to take medication –she was miss natural. I made sure 3 gabapentin and one adivan was always with her, but in the 4 months of stalking I only refilled it once, because she said she didn’t need it


She seems to keep saying that Morgan did not take medication, especially not for depression/anxiety. What is ativan prescribed for besided anxiety? I tried to briefly research it, but could not find any info about what else it would be prescribed for.

Also, she keeps saying there was an old prescription (that was found in her tox report, among 4 other medications), but Morgan had not taken it in 1 1/2 years. How does she know that? She knew how many pills were left in that bottle from 1 1/2 years ago?

If she had anxiety or something, it's not that big of a deal. Plenty of people do, but I get the feeling she is trying to hide something about all the medication that she does "not" take, which is "not" for depression.

Sensitivity about her cause of death? Probably.

Anonymous said...

Nanna Francis, thank you for posting the link to the Billie Jean Dunn radio broadcast interview. I listened to most of it, only skipping ahead a couple of places where I was getting weary of listening to those two illiterates who hosted the program. They never did introduce themselves, only eventually I picked it up that they were calling themselves Russell and Angie or Angela, and kept referring to their facebook.

Wow, those have to be two of the most awful butchers of the english language that I've ever heard, almost to the point of being babbling idiots. If I sounded that awful, I would have to keep my mouth shut forever. The dummies. There were a couple of so-called "call ins", don't know who they were. Obviously friends of either Billie or the 'hosts'.

And then there was Billie Jean who was in her glory with her ever so sweetly given answers. She claims to be at odds with Shawn, now hardly has anything to do with him, calls him a liar, now wonders if she was wrong to believe in him and isn't defending him anymore. Yeah, right. We've heard that old saw before, haven't we? She laid on her total disapproval of the CC PO real heavy, many nasty comments.

Unbelievably, she claims what a wonderful mother she was, how much she loved and cared for Hailey, she would never allow anything to happen to her, no, neither she or Clint ever knew that Hailey was scared of Shawn, had she known he wouldn't have been there, no one could love Hailey like she did, yada yada.

A good mother? A good MOTHER??! For one thing, she would have never blown her money on dope had she been a good mother. Had she been a good mother Shawn would have never been shacked up there with her and two very impressionable teenaged kids; she would have never let him in her home again after his initial threat to her, Hailey and Clint; she would have had a lifelong restraining order against him.

Neither would she or Shawn have ever brought drugs into the home or gotten high around those kids, there would have been no filthy materials and deviate videos, adult porn and child porn, violent sex movies and beastiality that SHE participated in the making of. NONE of this would have ever happened had she been a good mother. God help us all; THAT is a good mother? For those reasons alone, if there were no others, I would have to conclude that Billie is as guilty as the day is long in that precious girls' death and disappearance.

I don't know what to believe about her saying that Clint was at her house the night of the so-called New Year's Eve party that so much to-do has been made over. Frankly, I never did see it as much of a party. Her side of the story is that Clint was there that evening, that he came over there often during that period of time, that he was also sitting right there during her firt interview with Nancy disGrace, which he could have been. The truth as known only to Billie Jean? Who can say? But again, to be honest, I never had much faith in Clint either who is nothing more than a dope addicted stupid, direlect pothead and an illegal HUD squatter, or that piggy woman of his who was so jealous of Hailey spending time with her daddy. I don't put much past him either so long as he can get some pot out of it.

Thanks again for the link.

MizzMarple said...

Hi MissUnderstood,

Yes, JQ has some info there, and you can express your opinion there more than you can at WS.

I am trying to apply Statement Analysis as I read the Blog -- and even I who has very little knowledge of SA except for what I have learned here -- see a lot of inconsistencies, changes in tense and person, and many things that make absolutely NO sense.

I hope to finish the blog soon !

Tania Cadogan said...

It is SATAN who performs every one of those many transgressions, evils, deformaties and sicknesses you outline above and many more. No, God did NOT make any mistakes

Are you saying then that satan created the children who were born sick, disabled, gay.lesbian, bisexual, transgender or intersex?

At the moment of conception it was satan that gave life?
Are you giving satan the same power as god, the ability to create life?

If you aren't, and god doesn't make mistakes then ipso facto god, must by default, be creating sick and diabled children, he must be deliberately creating children who grow up to be gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender and intersex.
In which case they are not being sinful since god created them the way they are and it is humans who are trying to change the sexuality of the person to what we perceive as the norm who are being sinful even to doing the work of satan, who, if you believe in good and evil, is sowing the seeds of hatred and discord in society.

I am an atheist , i do not believe in any deity good, bad or indifferent.

MissUnderstood said...

Wednesday, August 10, 2011 –the 9th day of Morgan’s Stalking

Steve is now getting upset with me, because he knows how loud I talk and feels that a person outside trying to listen to what we are saying could hear me through our bedroom windows, which are being kept open to let the cool night air in.



madalynandgrace on October 3, 2012 at 7:59 am said:

I have a question. If y’all knew you had a stalker, why did y’all leave the windows open at night? I would have had my house in lockdown.

TIngram on October 3, 2012 at 1:22 pm said:

Our house was in lockdown –it was hot and we only had the windows open when we were up and in the house –never after we were asleep and never more that a few inches… luckily we had the really good crank out windows that are hard to break in through and they were always shut and locked when we went to bed or left the house.


Marz said...

I was just thinking the same thing. I can even understand possible emotional duress from something like that, "I had to see a doctor because a 50lb kid beat me up" is not exactly something a 220lb ex-footballer would be happy admitting.
That said-- of COURSE this kid can do damage. My husband was put into jui jutsu as a little kid (same age) and his instructors regularly put him up against 30-40 year old men who would come to the dojo looking for a fight. And yes, my husband would hand their asses to them. These were men with little/no training, mind you.... the hubby didn't fair so well when he sparred one of the Gracies (I don't rightly know which one...).

MissUnderstood said...

MizzMarple, idk if you're still following Morgans case, but this website has quite a bit of info:


Periwinkle Paisley said...

I disagree. This only means that he was kicked multiple times with the last kick being successful.

Periwinkle Paisley said...

I believe him (the teacher.) His statement says:
“I tried to hold his wrists,..."

He was not successful holding the boy's wrists. The child was able to worm out of the grasp of a large, physically fit man.

"... and he began biting me," Webster said.

The boy was stopped from biting.

“I took him to the principal’s office,..."

First person singular and event specific.

"... and he kicked me in the ankle, and one kick landed right on my knee. I felt a pop.’ "

The word 'landed' is NOT passive. When you 'land' something, it takes careful manuevering whether literally or figuratively: It takes skill to land a shot with an arrow or a gun. It takes even more skill to land an airplane. It takes finesse to land a job. It takes an entire team of scentists and a great deal of money to land the Mars Rover. In boxing the holy grail of punches is landing a haymaker. So when someone, who teaches phys ed for a living no less, says 'one kick landed right on my knee' it means that it not only directly hit the knee but it hit in precisely the spot that the kicker was aiming. What the average person may not know is that it only takes FIVE pounds of pressure to break a knee. A child trained in Karate is more than capable of that sort of kick.

He probably won't win his suit with people laughing that a great big man got beat up by a little kid. But what was he supposed to do? Use his superior strength and size to overpower him and teach him a (much needed) lesson? I think he showed admirable restraint.

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