Monday, December 28, 2015

Theory: Blackburn Murder and Spousal Involvement

The following is a composite theory based solely upon the opinions of law enforcement professionals trained in Statement Analysis.  I call it "The Baker's Dozen" where those with a minimum of 5 years experience, and a maximum of 40 years experience all weighed in on the Amanda Blackburn murder.

They have no association with the investigation and have only gleaned the information from media.

They relied upon Statement Analysis, Behavioral Analysis, and their own extensive experience in investigating homicides, as well as home invasions.  

This is a short consensus of their opinion and what they think happened.    It is a narrative of opinion.  

All parties are innocent until proven guilty, including those in custody now.  Police have stated that they knew, "100%" (from media) that the husband of the victim was not the shooter.  Suspects are in custody in the murder. This represents private opinions on the publicly stated quotes and information. 

Picture a needle with -10 to the left, 0 in the center, and + 10 to the right.  0 is neutral, while moving negative to the left, indicates potential guilt of the husband, while moving to the right suggests innocence of the husband.  

1.  Statistics

Most homicides involving pregnant women prove out to show involvement by the man close to her and the pregnancy, including husband, ex husband, estranged husband, or boyfriend.  

Jealousy can enter such cases and lead to violence. 

Some shaken baby victims, for example,  were killed by the non-biological husband, who resented the child that he did not father. In this case, it is not known if there was infidelity on the part of the victim, but there was nothing in the statements to suggest anything but the husband being the father of the unborn child.  

That the number one suspect in the murder of pregnant women is a statistic not ignored by the investigators and all felt this was important to be open to. 

2.  Relationship Quality 

In domestic homicides, the quality of the relationship is always 'front and center' in the investigation. Since husband/boyfriends are the most likely responsible, investigators ask if there was a history of marital discord. If so, the percentages move in the specific direction of the earlier statistic. 

In this case we are told by both the victim and the husband that the marital relationship was in turmoil to the point of separation, and with specific elements. 

In domestic homicides, the husband is first viewed, and then the quality of the relationship is viewed, but investigators then look for something specific to happen to cause the violence:  this is a "trigger." When a stressor or trigger is found, it also moves the statistical needle to move. 

3.  Trigger

A 'trigger' or a 'stressor' is something that pushes the relationship to the level where violence goes from thought to action; a stressor is sought to be identified by investigators.  Many times the stressor is infidelity.  This becomes an underlying anger that suppressed, can eventually surface against the child (shaken baby syndrome above) where the 'cuckolded' husband is saddled with a constant living breathing reminder of his wife's infidelity.  It may be worse if the child is a boy and looks like the biological father.  Infidelity on either part can be a trigger.  If the husband has a new love interest, it could be a trigger in the bad relationship, just as if the wife has been unfaithful to him.  

Other triggers can include sudden loss of job, change of job, loss of support, death in the family, pregnancy, and so on.  Investigators seek to learn if something within the relationship has changed making a bad relationship now worse. 

In this case, the investigators conclusively pointed to the husband's own identification of the trigger:  pregnancy. The husband specifically named the pregnancy as the stressor or trigger that made the relationship disruption, though the wife identified the husband's career as the source of discord.  

All recognized the acute obsession the husband had with his work as well as the distancing language between him and the victim as extreme.  The initial statement as well as the consistent distancing language shown towards the victim confirmed the husband's and victim's assertions about the marital discord. 

4.  Behavioral Analysis 

All investigators were bothered by the following points of the case:

a.  The timing of the home invasion 
b.  The element of violence in the home invasion 
c.  The patterns of behavior by the husband 

That each Tuesday he not only went to the gym at the same time, but always had the same pone call, at the same time on the very date of the home invasion robbery.  
That on this particular date, the husband stayed out of the home for a full 40 minutes while his wife lay dying stood out, in particular, as 'taking the coincidence too far' for reason, to the investigators.  

Although the showing off of a gun in a 'sermon' stood out, powerfully, as a revelation of what was on his mind, just days before the murder, it was the additional and apparently unnecessary delay, in the driveway, that no investigator could dismiss.  They stated that they would need to learn that this, too, was his pattern, to reduce the suspicion based upon coincidence.  

All were also confronted with the husband's lack of fear of the uncaught killers, as if he had confidence that he could not possibly be the next target.  

All attempted to 'explain away' any of these points, to justify innocence.  Each attempt, including examining religious language, did not suffice.  That there was no call for justice was bothersome, but not so much as having a home invaded and a wife murdered:  he had no fear.  This coupled with not only distancing language, but was taken with the drive for the career, all stood out as behavior suggesting knowledge of the crime.  

5.  Intelligence of Husband

This was another universal point:  he is well above average intelligence and would not have been so foolish as to hire a hitman. 

 They stated that if he orchestrated the opportunity for the crime, he used this intelligence. 

All expressed concern about local law enforcement training and/or ability to conduct a thorough interview with the husband, due to his mastery of language and intellect.  They stated that a highly skilled interviewer was needed and most expressed some concern of local unwillingness to utilize federal assistance in interviewing.  

The intelligence was noted in the publishing and commercializing of the murder; he knew how to present himself and attempt to utilize the death for the future salesmanship, including calling the murder a "story" and "event."  It was also noted that in his attempt to gain authority over others, he revealed himself in the 'shower' statement, which should stand very strongly to investigators in how to strategize the interview:  they must use his intelligence to get him to reveal the truth.  

6.  A Powerful Secret  

All stated that the analysis of the 'hidden secret lie' was likely sexuality.  This was affirmed by:;

a.  The mentor's statement about "something very wrong" in which a female would rectify
b.  The "shower" statement, which they concluded not only an association with the psychological need for cleansing. 
c.  His mentor's own wording:  while avoiding speaking of Christ's Resurrection and specific details of the victim's own life and love of Christ, the mentor spoke in sexual terms about the physical attributes of the husband indicating that sex was on the speaker's mind.  
d.  The videos.  They stated that the videos showed not only one who frequently spoke about sex, but seemed to have a need to persuade his audience of his sex drive...for women.  Examples cited included the reference to the gym, his depersonalizing of the victim in his 'we have to have sex before dinner' statement, as well as his deliberate choreographing for the audience, including clothing, bearing and appearance.  

That one would 'live a lie' is associated with continual stress and ongoing resentment, which can build over time, and be pushed to action by a stressor or 'trigger' event.  The lie, if true, that is lived, is one in which bitterness never goes away, even during happier times and can grow with time.  

If the victim knew of this secret, a sense of impotence could come over the liar, himself, and build resentment, fearful of exposure at any time, with the sense of living in a marriage of "blackmail", even unspoken, while being silently coerced into submission, lest 'she tell.'  

This can lead to great fear of not only exposure, but fear of divorce. 

A divorce would cripple his career and was not an option.  

The last portion of deep embittered feelings in living a lie is the thought that happiness or contentment may 'exist with another', only increasing resentment of the victim, over time.  

This was something heavily discussed in light of the distancing language he used.  The language of distance was consistent with resentment.  

The 'correction' of language was noted:  whether he or advisors read the analysis, there were changes made after analysis was posted.  

It was also noted, though not heavily, that the distancing language with his son (and pre born murdered child) was consistent with one 'living a lie in life', full time.  Each point continues to push the needle in the negative, lower and lower. 

7.  Home Invasions 

All pointed to the crime scene as having elements of possible staging, if, for example, she was not sexually assaulted.  In cases where the clothing is removed without sexual assault, the perpetrator may have done this for the appearance of sexual assault.  

 Other elements noted included the unlocked door combining with the routine of the gym, and the phone call, coupled with what is known about home invasions:  most seek to go in and out quickly, undetected, and want either items to quickly pawn, or cash, which would suggest prior knowledge of the home (drug dealers have cash, for example) but home invasions do not always have such violence, and if met with resistance, the violence is generally not associated with the removal of clothing.  

Questions that arose include if these same perpetrators committed violence in other robberies, and if so, what was the nature of the violence, and what was the result of the violence, warranting answers. 

Conclusion

The investigators all stated that the nature of the case pointed to anything but random.  The details all point to orchestration.  

What was asked was to consider this possible scenario:

That if the husband is involved, he would have used his intellect to orchestrate it, and would not have simply sought out a killer to be easily traced.  

He would have had contact with members higher up in the gang, through schools, or the church, who would hear an opportunity that included a severe complaint against the wife. They would  be able to send low level criminals to the right neighborhood, and to the right home, at the right time, where not only would the husband not be home, but the door would be unlocked, there would be items easily available for theft and pawning, while a 'hated woman' would be alone, hinting, but not stating, that life would be far better without her.   

Understanding that someone was willing to allow his home to be vandalized was enough of an invitation.  With complaints about the wife, especially the sexual complaints (which included public statements) would be enough 'hint' to let a gang know where an easy robbery would result and young gang's ruthlessness (dedication to the gang) could be tested.  

That the husband remained on the driveway for 40 minutes instead of taking the call inside the house upon his arrival stands out as 'all too much'  to be a coincidence.  It is not known, but apparently possible, that had he gone in 40 minutes earlier, that the stopping of the bleeding, or hinderance of it, may have saved her life.  

As they stated, everything taken together suggests orchestration of this crime.  The details each fall into place and given his intelligence, he would have 'suggested' a good place for a gang to hit, giving the address, date and time.

They needed to hear motive.  They did.  

They needed to have:  

1.  The statistics of who does this 
2.  The marital relationship weighed in the negative 
3.  The presence of a stressor or trigger taking a negative further
4.  The Behavior of the husband immediately after the murder
5.  Examined the husband's intellectual ability to pull this off
6.  A Secret, but powerful lie that is lived evidenced 
7.  Home invasions examined and factored in

They factored all of these in, with all fulfilled.  


Theories

Most theories in a homicide are presented for debate; while other theories present themselves over time.  

This is the latter. 

All these elements factored in to produce a theory that they felt would be difficult to disprove in order to be comfortable professionally.  

Some theories are presented and then examined.  In this case, the theory developed naturally, with the post crime statements and behavior.  

When a theory is developed naturally, we attempt to 'punch holes' in it, attempting to disprove it.  They found the 'needle' consistently pushing to the left, unable to make strong arguments to the contrary. 

Police, thus far, appear satisfied that they have solved the crime and that the husband is not involved.   

There are those who do not have access to the information police have suspect the husband's involvement.  







1,801 comments:

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Hey Jude said...

Yes, I did notice the last sentence and my own seeming doubt with regards to that - it's not what it seems, I just don't have the energy to unpack it. Just in case anyone was going to pick up on it. Too tired for all the hell and eternal damnation stuff right now - lol.

Sus said...

I have a question off the topic of the Christmas sermon.

Which LA Fitness gym did DB go to on Nov 10? Is that his usual gym?

Bingo3 said...

If LE truly believes that D has not involvement in this, then I am baffled! And I don't agree that he would be too disoriented to say my wife has been attacked! She is laying bleeding from her head without clothes on and he says it is an accident? I would be scared to death and begging for police to come! Scared for my own safety and my sons. He never showed any fear even before they caught the guys. And the waiting on the neighbor to go in and then call 911? No way LE thinks he has no involvement. I just can't accept that. And an 6:30 robbery in a culdesac while he is at the gym? I mean really. They have to be looking at this as strange even before all the odd behavior and lack of grief. And as far as Amanda being tired of it, your right I don't know that. She truly seemed to love him but the narcissistic behavior had to get old.

Sus said...

Thank you, Mdk. This is a great list. Very helpful.

Concerned said...

Me2l at 8:59 in response to Bingo3's astute comments:

If you doubt that Amanda was weary of Davey's rhetoric and not enchanted any longer, watch her face in the "date trip" to Chicago. Watch her call him out in a lie on one of the church videos.
I would expect a friend or family member to one day share what Amanda confided about Davey, probably in a court of law, maybe at a sentencing hearing.

Think again about how you could walk in on Amanda's crime scene and not automatically assume something sinister had occurred.
When a woman falls down in the LR, she doesn't lose her panties and have them laid down next to her. She doesn't push her top up like someone has tried to pull it off. Swisher Sweet cigar packages don't automatically show up on the counter.

About the unlocked door:
There was obvious concern over crime in the neighborhood, so much so that they organized a Neighborhood Watch. There was talk about crime when they gathered. These weren't wealthy people but they allocated part of their resources to cameras and alarm systems so, yes, there was concern. My husband doesn't have a young and vulnerable pregnant wife and a toddler but he locks our doors every time he leaves the house. So do I. It troubles me that Davey didn't just wonder if he might have left the door unlocked, he was SURE he did...as in, on purpose! He was a public person, on the Indy news and claimed to be reaching out to "the unloveable", so I'm betting he would have worried that they might break into his house.

Bingo3,
Having Meg waiting on him during the Christmas service was so odd to me too. He couldn't carry his own water up there knowing he was going to speaking for such a long (exhausting!) time? I do believe having someone wait on him feeds his belief that he is the big-time "pastor". I'm thankful that none of the men who've preached in our church were of his ilk.

Kate said...

Blogger Me2l said...
If I came home to find my spouse lying bleeding on the floor, my first thoughts would probably have been very unclear and confused, but they would not include a gun shot or an attack. It's just not something we think will happen to ourselves. Taking the opposite view for sake of discussion, perhaps DB leaving the door unlocked testifies to the theory he never expected a home invasion/attack on his wife (rather than that it means it was all part of his master plan to have his wife killed. Maybe? Just maybe.) Perhaps he did not feel that threat, hence the lack of a locked door. Did he always lock the door when he left?
December 31, 2015 at 8:59 AM
=======================================================================================

Yes, but Davey didn't just walk into a scene showing a wounded wife. She was stripped from the waist down and had her shirt pulled up. There was duct tape right next to her, along with credit cards and a swisher sweet wrapper on the counter. The door was unlocked, thanks to the loving husband.

I've gone through Davey's "sermons" with a fine tooth comb. That man talked non-stop about the crime in Indy, he knew better. Try googling his news clips for Inday prior to Amanda's death. He was well AWARE of the violence and crime in his area, overly aware.

rosy said...

Mdkd6262 said...
at 11:45 AM

Thank you again for the logistics! I saved it the first time then "lost" it.

Anonymous said...

Neighborhood Watch Meeting Oct. 2015: somewhere on the northeast side of Indy

Agenda:
1. Cookout/birthday celebration will be at the Smith's on Sat. the 15. Bring your own buns! Rain date 21st.

2. Introduction of new neighbors. Everybody give a big hoosier howdy to the Jones' who moved into 321 last week, all the way from Oklahoma.

3. Safety awareness, assignments. Remember to watch out for your neighbors. It's not just about cookouts. Try to give a damn. If you see something suspicious, such as young hoodlums smoking swishers that you don't recognize from the cookouts, call the watch captain to express your concerns. There are two identified watchmen per night - check the calendar - know your shift. Hell, patrol the perimeter if you dare. And if you hear gunshots and or loud screams, or in the unlikely event of hearing them both - you might want to consider calling 911.

And for gods sakes, don't forget to check the Halloween candy for razors and crack cocaine.

Happy Fall!

mom2many said...

I have very little time with all the kiddos home from school for the holidays, but I want to point out what struck me most from Lynda's transcription of the sermon that I have not seen mentioned yet.

Davey Blackburn prays, "Love you, Jesus." Sandwiched among sentences with very clear and appropriate pronoun usage, Davey drops this particular pronoun. That says everything to me about his state of belief.

----
What I pray in this moment right now that you would seek every heart in this room to you, and to you alone. That we’d hear from you in ways that we’d never heard from you before. I pray for the unbelieving heart in this room, you would do something to stir up the callousness of hearts. That it is, it is indescribably you. It is irrevocably (Davy pronounced it ear-ro-voca-blee) you. That not one soul can walk out of here not believing that you are God and you are good. Love you Jesus. We ask this all in your name.

Anonymous said...

One of the worship leaders , Tommy, who is Twitter friends with DB actually tweeted a link to the Dec 23 sermon saying it was one of the best he has ever heard. He also tweeted long time ago a link to an article written by another Christian in support of gay marriage.

rosy said...

mom2many said...
at at 2:29 PM
-------------

Listening closely, I'm pretty sure he said: "We love you Jesus...." The "We" is enunciated rapidly, but it's there.

rosy said...

On "irrevocably (Davy pronounced it ear-ro-voca-blee)" - thank you lynda for the transcript!

Yes he did. an interesting detail like the emphasis he puts on the "p" on "hope."

The word irrevocable has an acceptable variant according to Merriam-Webster: "adjective ir·rev·o·ca·ble \i-ˈre-və-kə-bəl, ˌi(r)- sometimes ˌir-(r)ə-ˈvō-kə-\"

Hear both in How to Pronounce Irrevocable
https://youtu.be/OTRet_7e1t4

Irrevocably, the adverb, has no recorded variant pronunciation as yet; but it makes sense in parallel to the root word, revoke.

Compare English and US pronunciations of revocable:
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/pronunciation/english/revocable

Sometimes odd non-standard pronunciation comes from being partly self-taught, an individual learning to read more words than he hears around him. DB has an extensive vocabulary and a pedagogic tendency to spell things out and make them trendy (or dumb them down). This approach to public speaking can facilitate communication with wide audiences. Or it can be used to manipulate listeners and degrade the message.

NT advises: "By their fruit you will recognize them."

Anon "I" said...

The purple coloring is probably to emphasize the illusion of royalty. As if Resonate and DB are divinely appointed by God. I think the beard and vest are to give him the appearance of a disheveled, grieving husband. The background music was a bit much after 17 minutes in as it was so repetitious. DB loves himself some drama, IMHO.

I noticed in the beginning when he prayed, he opened his eyes and was looking around at the crowd response while praying to God. I found this to be unusual. I have often heard "every eye closed and every head bowed" but from my experience, it has been when you are asked to raise your hand if you surrender to Jesus or agree with an idea. It's to give a measured feeling of privacy, although no one has super-glued anyone's eyelids from opening for a peak.

After 20 minutes in, most in any crowd start to tune you out. Hour and a half sermons make for an extraordinary act of patience with a side of miffed attitude (and I've been guilty of checking who may be preaching in the coming weeks after enduring such an experience... sad, but true).

Plus, I see the Christmas season as a season of hope and wonder. He failed to deliver on grand hope, but he probably left people with more than enough of the "wonder" part. SMH

I question the part of Mary holding Jesus. They had to get special permission to take his body off the cross and had to hurry because the Sabbath was quickly approaching. I'm not saying that it didn't happen, it is just not elaborated upon in the Bible that I know of... probably linked to tradition as someone so kindly explained. The ladies did not return until Sunday morning to do the traditional burying process because of the Sabbath.

LOLing with Hey Jude on:
"...no worse off than te rest of us, though that might depend on how much they tithe. Lol."

My last observation is the stuttering is getting out of control, IMHO. I think he got to four in a row. Didn't Peter say that when you get to seven in a row, the person is about to have a mental breakdown. DB is looking more and more unhinged to me as time progresses...





Anonymous said...

Anon "I", Peter talks about the "Stuttering I Scale," not just stuttering in general.

Here's one of his posts about it: http://statement-analysis.blogspot.com/2015/01/dorothy-sims-and-casey-anthony.html


It's possible Davey has always had stuttering issues since childhood.

Anonymous said...

Also, I think some folks need to re-watch the video where Amanda supposedly "calls him out in a lie." It's obvious he's being facetious when he says a couple regretted moving away and wanted to come back (pay attention to the context of what he said before that). When Amanda says, "Not true," they're both kind of grinning. He's not upset that she "called him out" because he was kidding around.

Pak31 said...

@Me2l, 8:59, I agree that if I came home and my spouse was lying on the floor bleeding my first thought would be accident BUT her underwear was off and next to her, her shirt was pulled up and her wallet and credit cards on the floor next to her. I don't know about you but if I saw that I'd figure out pretty quickly that she was attacked. I don't know how you wouldn't assume an attack took place. If she was just lying there fully clothed ok, but it had to be obvious that she was assaulted. He then would move her right? He should have called for medical assistance, which he did but it was clear that she didn't just trip and fall therefore police should have been summoned. I try to picture him as an innocent man walking in and finding her. He would run to her and try to help her, she was shot at least three times, her face punched and tooth knocked out. Plus her half naked body. Did he even think someone could have been in the home? Wouldn't his next reaction be to check for his son? He did t appear to because he was in his crib when police came. I say BS that he wouldn't know that was a crime scene and that she was shot. Total B S . Obviously I need more info on what went on after he found her. It his actions were sad and pathetic. Also I'm not yelling at you or totally disagreeing, I just can't make it make sense in my mind.

Anonymous said...

Just because Weston was in his crib when the authorities arrived, it does not mean Davey didn't check on him. Should he have brought Weston downstairs and allowed him to toddle around in his dying mother's blood? How was Davey suppose to watch Weston if he was attempting CPR or otherwise rendering aid while also talking to 911? The safest place for him to be was in his crib while Davey called 911 and EMTS arrived to help Amanda.

lynda said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
Anon "I", Peter talks about the "Stuttering I Scale," not just stuttering in general.

Here's one of his posts about it: http://statement-analysis.blogspot.com/2015/01/dorothy-sims-and-casey-anthony.html


It's possible Davey has always had stuttering issues since childhood.

December 31, 2015 at 5:04 PM

=========================================================

I'm just going from memory here but Davey seems to stutter quite a bit on the pronoun "I"
particularly in the beginning of his endless sermon. Some stuttering (on other words) seems to be because he's talking to fast or at least it gives the impression it may be because he's talking to fast. He stutters quite a bit on the "We" and "we're" also.

Does anyone have anything to say regarding him saying the words "Three days" 8 times in 2 or 3 sentences? One sentence was just repeating it 5 times in a row. I know he was saying it in a "religious" context as part of the story but still...seems excessive and am interested in regards to SA.

Also, as far as Davey calling 911 and such..I forgot where I saw it, possibly on Amanda's twitter or something but when you walk into the front door of their home the LR is to the left and it is a STEP DOWN. PC states she was found in the LR with a plant and stand? overturned, underwear off, duct tape, top pulled up, and a bloody mess (People have argued that bullet wounds may not bleed that much but being hit in the mouth with a gun, knocking a tooth out, splitting a lip, bleeds like crazy)
My point is, she wasn't at the bottom of the stairs, or near a counter or anything. Why would he say she was unconscious and injured? The scene IMMEDIATELY presents itself as a crime. She's in a sunken living room, with overturned objects, facedown, bloody, unclothed. Give me a break.

rosy said...

Anonymous Anon "I" said...
at 4:47 PM
The purple coloring is probably to emphasize the illusion of royalty. As if Resonate and DB are divinely appointed by God.
-----------------
Yes, maybe -- the royal line of David, royal blue, all that. Resonate's music draws on songs from Hillsong, the Pentecostal mega-church in Australia.

Derek Barrett, Resonate's worship pastor, on the guitar, says: "My wife and I were former Worship Pastors for Hillsong Church in Sydney, Australia - so our current musical style is very similar. Our other musical influences for our Sunday service include: Hillsong United, Bethel, Elevation Worship, Jesus Culture, and Passion."

Hillsong music videos, some of them produced in multiple languages for churches around the world, others recorded in mass arenas, are spectacular.

Worthy is The Lamb
https://youtu.be/4J6oBxqDoq4

"How Great is our God"
https://youtu.be/99CGh3rzJ00

BTW, comments on these songs include "Love you Lord" and "love u jesus."

With the th rise of Hillsong from "humble beginnings" to "global sensations" have come claims that it is a cult:

http://hillsongchurchwatch.com/2015/04/21/hillsong-the-multi-million-dollar-crazy-cult/

Suzanne said...

Lynda said:

"Does anyone have anything to say regarding him saying the words "Three days" 8 times in 2 or 3 sentences? One sentence was just repeating it 5 times in a row. I know he was saying it in a "religious" context as part of the story but still...seems excessive and am interested in regards to SA."

Wasn't it 3 days from the sermon with the gun until the murder?

Anonymous said...

Lynda, do you mean with regard to the "liar's number"? I don't think that would apply here because he's referencing part of the Bible that includes "three days." The liar's number applies to deceptive people who have to think up a number.

I remember being taught repetition as a form of emphasis years ago in my college speech classes, or he might be "stalling" while he figures out what he wants to say next, haha.

Anonymous said...

Liturgical colors ... purple or blue is used for Advent season (Christmas). Purple is also used for Lent, I do believe. I doubt it has anything to do with the "illusion of royalty."

Anonymous said...

...oops I meant assuming the person is guilty (at 7:09).

rosy said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
at 7:09 PM

Liturgical colors ... purple or blue is used for Advent season (Christmas). Purple is also used for Lent, I do believe. I doubt it has anything to do with the "illusion of royalty."
==============

These colors (filters put over the lights) featured in Hillsong videos for effect, not liturgical value.

Resonate church uses them all year round. E.g. blue and magenta in Love Song, September 13, 2015. Liturgical color in September would be green.

Resonate used vivid green in one video but not liturgically.

Anonymous said...

Anon at 7:09/7:12 ... I would think that because lying would still be stressful -- even for someone who knows SA -- that they would probably self-edit so much that they'd still give themselves away. Just my guess :)

Anonymous said...

Anon 7:30 that's what I think too! It's the world we live in. I think the benefits of a public teaching forum like this far outweigh any possible detractions, as far as guilty people "knowing" what to say or not say. In fact it was abundantly clear that Davey Blackburn had visited (and even posted) on this blog, and then started talking differently.

lynda said...

Anonymous said...
What if a person becomes a good student of Statement Analysis, and learns all the "red flags", like "absence of reliable denial", and "the number 3", and so much more, and then that person is accused of a crime, like at work, or by law enforcement. Won't that person have an advantage that most guilty people don't have? Won't that person know what to say and what not to say?

December 31, 2015 at 7:09 PM

========================================

I think if you had a "prepared' statement (such as John Ramsey when he issued a reliable denial finally) SA doesn't apply because you are 'parroting" what the interviewer said or you HAVE learned what you are supposed to say. We know Davey has been here or at least heard about it because he self-corrected. It's in the free editing stage that you will still be caught. As Peter says, you choose a word in a millisecond from your internal dictionary of 25,000 or so words and lying causes stress and / or sensitivity..even for liars.

Yes..I briefly thought of the liars number 3 but I didn't think it applied either because of context. I just find it strange.

Wasn't it 2 days before Amanda was murdered he did gun sermon? Anyone?

Anonymous said...

I believe the "Free Editing Process" happens no matter what, even if the person in question has been exposed to the concept. Even after learning about the free editing process, I've noticed my own speech hasn't changed (but I'm not being deceitful) but even if I were being deceptive, I can't imagine that I would be capable of doing anything other than "free editing", in the moment. I'm not super-human.

Anonymous said...

I'm not so sure Davey Blackburn has ever really posted here. I've been accused of being both Davey and Ryan, so when I see folks accusing others of being Davey, too, I kinda have to laugh. Basically, anyone who has dared to suggest he wasn't involved in Amanda's murder has been accused of being Davey, haha.

He might read here, though.

Anonymous said...

He posted something here early on. It was something about he was comparing himself to Ezekiel from the Bible, and how God killed Ezekiel's wife, and how Davey felt like he didn't want to "take up this cross" or something. Quite a long while back. He even signed it with his full name. It was before his Ezekiel Dry Bones speech at his father-in-law's church.

Unknown said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Here it is:

Anonymous said...

So what I’m learning is that I want all the benefits of a Godly, successful, and disciplined life, but I don’t want to go through the pain, suffering, and hard work that is involved.

Ezekiel had an incredible relationship with God, but he went through a ton of crap in order to be that close with Him (see Ezekiel 3:1-2, 4:4-8, 5:1, 24:15-24). God killed Ezekiel’s wife so that he could feel the pain that Israel was about to endure! I mean, what the heck! God allowed him to literally feel the weight of what He was going to do to the Israelite people.

I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him.

-Davey Blackburn

November 25, 2015 at 10:21 AM

Rella said...

I think that came from Davey's old blog and someone copy/pasted it here at the time. I'm pretty certain I read that on that blog he used to keep.

Rella said...

I just double checked. That came from daveyblackburn.com and was a part of a post he made, dated July 8, 2008.

Rella said...

Here is the link.....

http://daveyblackburn.com/2008/07/08/that-but-not-this/

Hey Jude said...

Lynda - yes, the 'Worship as a Weapon' sermon was Sunday Nov 8th - Amanda was shot on Tuesday Nov 10th - she was taken off life support on the 12th.

Anonymous said...

Rella 8:05. I checked the link to DB's "blog" about Ezekiel. There's no date shown. How do we know it wasn't just recently posted? Those exact word were posted HERE on Nov 25th. Also, what a coincidence that after that statement by DB was posted HERE, it was very shortly after that he made his now infamous "Ezekiel Dry Bones" speech at his father-in-law's church.

Anonymous said...

Rella, I think someone just copied and pasted that here, too. Why would he post here (and sign his real name) when there are so many people here practically foaming at the mouth with hatred for him? Just to stir up the hornets' nest even more? Doesn't make sense.

Anonymous said...

Anon at 8:12, there is indeed a date on that blog post. A bunch of people were digging through his blogs, someone found one pertaining to the death of a WIFE, so they pasted it here, I'm willing to bet.

Rella said...

Anon @812-

Near the bottom the date is listed. Also, if you search on that blog the word Ezekiel, that post will come up and right below the summary, before it lists the other posts with Ezekiel, you will see the date.

Anonymous said...

It was early on, shortly after the murder. He posted that here in hopes that he could ingratiate himself to people here, the location of maybe most of his detractors, plus he was getting ready for his big Ezekiel speech.

Rella said...

Anon @816-

I had already seen his blog prior to the post in question being posted in the comments here. If he did post here, I don't think he would sign his name.

Hey Jude said...

Davey wouldn't post here - his browser activity is monitored - it might be a bit of a giveaway. Well, if it still monitored now he's a free agent. I suppose he could use one of his apps to get round it if he was desperate to know what he might be giving away. His mentor might find it a bit unexpected for Davey to be checking out this website just at the moment.

I, too, wish people wouldn't accuse other posters of being Davey, or whoever is under discussion whenever - it makes me question the judgement of the poster who is making the accusation.

Anonymous said...

People here are saying "there was a date" on that blog post, but no one has yet offered the actual date.

Rella said...

He DID NOT post that here. Someone posted it here and put his name at the bottom. Just like those random memes you see all over the internet where it has some meaningful saying and at the bottom it has.....
-Rella

Rella said...

Anon @824-

I did give a date. July 8,2008

Anonymous said...

Rella, what an amazing coincidence that after what you say was someone else posting DB's words onto this website, very shortly after that DB compared himself to Ezekiel in a sermon at his father in law's church!!! Wow!!

Anonymous said...

Anon at 8:28, what other story from the Bible might he compare to his situation? Can you think of another involving the death of someone's wife that would apply?

Anonymous said...

Ezekiel HERE, and Ezekiel THERE. Just another coincidence!!

Rella said...

Anon @828-

Davey Blackburn is full of "amazing coincidences". I don't know what you're getting at. Just say whatever you feel you need to say.

Anonymous said...

Ezekiel 24:15-25New International Version (NIV)

Ezekiel’s Wife Dies
15 The word of the Lord came to me: 16 “Son of man, with one blow I am about to take away from you the delight of your eyes. Yet do not lament or weep or shed any tears. 17 Groan quietly; do not mourn for the dead. Keep your turban fastened and your sandals on your feet; do not cover your mustache and beard or eat the customary food of mourners.”

18 So I spoke to the people in the morning, and in the evening my wife died. The next morning I did as I had been commanded.

19 Then the people asked me, “Won’t you tell us what these things have to do with us? Why are you acting like this?”

20 So I said to them, “The word of the Lord came to me: 21 Say to the people of Israel, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I am about to desecrate my sanctuary—the stronghold in which you take pride, the delight of your eyes, the object of your affection. The sons and daughters you left behind will fall by the sword. 22 And you will do as I have done. You will not cover your mustache and beard or eat the customary food of mourners. 23 You will keep your turbans on your heads and your sandals on your feet. You will not mourn or weep but will waste away because of[a] your sins and groan among yourselves. 24 Ezekiel will be a sign to you; you will do just as he has done. When this happens, you will know that I am the Sovereign Lord.’

25 “And you, son of man, on the day I take away their stronghold, their joy and glory, the delight of their eyes, their heart’s desire, and their sons and daughters as well—

Footnotes:

Ezekiel 24:23 Or away in
New International Version (NIV)
Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

Bad Juju said...

But what I was hinting at in my post at 8:32 (was posting anonymously, finally made a Blogger profile) is that there just aren't that many stories from the Bible that he could draw from for his "message" that deal specifically with the death of a wife, etc. So it's really not that coincidental that he brought it up after Amanda's death after making a blog post years ago about Ezekiel.

What other story from the Bible might he have used (keeping his "message" in mind, that is)?

Unknown said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

These are just rhetorical Q's: Can you accuse a person of murder if that person merely "wished" their spouse dead? I mean, the person wanted the spouse's death anyway, so shouldn't they be considered "guilty"? Can you place guilt (on that person) for the death of the person if the spouse reacts with relief and happiness? He's clearly happy to be rid of her. So, even if he didn't have anything to do with it, isn't he "guilty", since it was his "wish"?

Anonymous said...

9:25 that was a statement about spiritual/moral guilt.

Anonymous said...

Do you secretly wish for someone you know to die soon? It's not uncommon. If that person were to die, would you feel any guilt regarding that person's death?

Anonymous said...

Don't know a whole lot about how gangs work, but could someone please explain the theory that if the murderer and accomplices are at the bottom of the chain why they wouldn't talk to receive a lesser sentence? (or atleast the trigger man), who will most likely receive the death penalty... JCC

rosy said...

Anonymous Anonymous said
November 25, 2015 at 10:21 AM
December 31, 2015 at 7:58 PM
================

Thanks to all who brought this up again. I would take it that the anon post on Nov 25 was intended to point people here to the oddity of the post about Ezekiel all those years ago. Not that DB posted here, but someone with a sharp eye did.

Surely, it is significant that Davey was thinking about the death of Ezekiel's wife back in July 2008 and thought of that death again not long after Amanda was killed.

The date of the blog entry, July 8 2008 matters. At the end of July 1008 he and Amanda married. So, a few weeks before their marriage, he was thinking about how he wanted a relationship with Jesus like Ezekiel's relationship with God - a relationship which for Ezekiel included the sacrificial death of his wife.

A few weeks after Amanda was killed, these premarital thoughts of Ezekiel came back from whatever vault he'd kept them in ... and he stepped out of the shower to speak prophecy in his father-in-law's church.

Talk about return of the repressed. And he didn't spare a tear for Ezekiel's wife, did he?

To re-quote his blog entry from July 2008. Really this is an odd entry for a man to make a few weeks before his wedding. As though, immediately before marriage, he's already fantasizing about a way out that might lead to his great success.

"So what I’m learning is that I want all the benefits of a Godly, successful, and disciplined life, but I don’t want to go through the pain, suffering, and hard work that is involved.

Ezekiel had an incredible relationship with God, but he went through a ton of crap in order to be that close with Him (see Ezekiel 3:1-2, 4:4-8, 5:1, 24:15-24). God killed Ezekiel’s wife so that he could feel the pain that Israel was about to endure! I mean, what the heck! God allowed him to literally feel the weight of what He was going to do to the Israelite people.

I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him."

rosy said...

^^^ At the end of July 2008. I thought the wedding date was July 28, but Amber and her husband (married same day in double wedding) in some years record celebrating their anniversary on the weekend of July 31.

rosy said...

Anonymous JCC said...
at 9:57 PM

Don't know a whole lot about how gangs work, but could someone please explain the theory that if the murderer and accomplices are at the bottom of the chain why they wouldn't talk to receive a lesser sentence? (or at least the trigger man), who will most likely receive the death penalty...
--------------------
No firsthand knowledge, but gangs have their own code of honor. Snitching is against the code. Prisons house many gang members. Even if a man were spared the death penalty in return for snitching, he might not live long in prison.

Anonymous said...

gang members do NOT go to prison as snitches making deals.

how stupid can people be?

rosy said...

Anonymous said...
at 9:25 PM

Can you accuse a person of murder if that person merely "wished" their spouse dead?
===================
No, but if the person is capable of guilt, their own conscience might accuse them. The person might develop symptoms because of this. It's one of the sources theorized for "survivor guilt." Freud discusses it in "Mourning and Melancholia."

Aggressive or hostile feelings towards a person one loves is not uncommon. If anyone who had such thoughts could be accused of murder if the loved one was killed, justice would fail.

Anonymous said...

Woah so he posted that Ezekiel thing about God killing his wife a few days before his marriage to Amanda.

"I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him."

Kate said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
Do you secretly wish for someone you know to die soon? It's not uncommon. If that person were to die, would you feel any guilt regarding that person's death?
December 31, 2015 at 9:45 PM
===================================================================================

That's a great question. I don't know that I've ever wished death upon another human being, but I guess if I did, I'd still feel a little guilty.

Had I left the front door open and rambled on the phone out in my driveway for 40 minutes, (if I were a man) knowing my wife was inside, newly pregnant and could be having morning sickness, needing some assistance with the little one (among a ton of other morning stuff to attend to), at the very least.... I'd be absolutely racked with guilt.

Concerned said...

rosy at 10:13
I hope your brilliant post doesn't get lost here.
Peter sure needs to read this!
Perhaps Davey was marrying because his career needed someone like Amanda for a slingshot but comforted himself with the thought that there was a way out?

Anonymous said...

thank you, rosy for your reply. With a family member in law enforcement for 20+ years, I realize that some gang members do choose to snitch and as a result go to prison for a lesser sentence. Just can't wrap my head around the thought of not taking that chance vs taking the death penalty. again, thank you for your educated reflection rather than the "judgemental" response given by anon 10:39 JCC

Anonymous said...

I fantasized about the death of an abusive parent, from a very young age (6 or 7). I never acted on my wish, but I had it. I can totally relate to wishing someone dead.

Hey Jude said...

Rosy - scary stuff, or could be. Anyone could be forgiven for thinking that Davey, being the 'strategist' was a long term thinker, and that he only married because it was necessary to the advancement of his career, and that it needn't be for ever. Perry Noble wasn't keen on sponsoring him until he produced Amanda.

rosy said...

Concerned said...
at 10:53 PM

To follow up, it appears their wedding was Aug 1. Amanda posted a lovely Instagram on Aug 1 2015 for their 7th anniversary.

Some of the links in DB's blog post July 8, 2008 no longer work. Looking at the source code shows he listed 5 things he wanted, all of which would take work.

He wanted "A killer beach body," but didn't want to go through extreme gym workouts.

He wanted to "own THAT" - an Apple Mac Book Pro - but "I don't want to go through" budgeting - link to Monthly budget tutorial on Excel (YouTube).

"I want a wife like THAT" - link to an image of purity (purity.jpg) on a website that no longer displays it (http://www.c28.com/productimages/purity.jpg) - But I don't want to go through THIS: (link to a book on a website no longer online)."

"So what I'm learning is that I want all the benefits of a Godly, successful, and disciplined life, but I don't want to go through the pain, suffering, and hard work that is involved."

Then he summarizes Ezekiel's story to explain his final concern: "I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him."

Bad Juju said...

According to the National Gang Crime Research Center, "about a third of all gang members would snitch on other gang members given the right incentives by police or prosecutors."

http://www.ngcrc.com/ngcrc/page95ec.htm


Here's more:

"Three different forced-choice questions were included in the survey that measure the extent to which the gang members under the right condition might become police informants. None of the gang types (People, Folks, Crips, Bloods, Other) differ on any of these three measures of snitching. All the gang types have the same proportion of potential snitches. About a fifth of all gang members would rat on a gang leader to a secret Grand Jury for $1,000 dollars. About a fifth would be willing to testify in open court against a gang leader for $5,000 cash and witness protection services. About over a fourth of the gang members would "flip" and testify against someone in a gang if they were given complete immunity and all charges were dropped against them."


This research is from 1995. I'm looking for something more current.

Bad Juju said...

In other words, never say never ;)

rosy said...

Bad Juju said...
at 11:23 PM
----------------

Interesting! Thanks for looking this up.

rosy said...

AP report on Larry Taylor arrest calls string of violence "unprecedented"

Man accused in pastor's wife's death charged in 2nd slaying
December 29,

"Marion County Prosecutor Terry Curry said the felony charges Taylor now faces — two murders, a rape during a home burglary and two other home burglaries — are the most violent he has brought against a single individual during his five years as prosecutor. Those crimes occurred between Nov. 3 and Nov. 10, court documents allege.

"We've charged Mr. Taylor with five very violent crimes in the course of an eight-day period and certainly in our five years in office that's unprecedented," he said in an interview. Curry said the only comparable cases he has handled were two violent home invasions that occurred in October 2013."
https://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=37935086&nid=481

Anonymous said...

My new year's resolution is to quit reading and posting about this case. Just kidding! Ha ha!

Anonymous said...

As a vegetarian, I'm upset and offended that I was forced to select pictures of "steak", in order to exercise my freedom of speech on this blog. Now I'm feeling the trauma of being "triggered" by the images of dead animals on a plate, images which I normally avoid. JUST KIDDING!!!!! HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Someone should have Davey followed. He just had his only socially and religiously acceptable outlet for his sexual energy killed. Per the tenants of his belief system and in order to keep his financial and professional future safe, he will have to re-marry in order to have sex again. Based upon what I have read, I don't think he will be able to wait that long. There are legions of women out there who are turned on at just the thought of comforting this man under these circumstances. They will be all but throwing themselves at him. And if he is homosexual, the temptations will hard to control.

I think that the convenience of his wife's death will end undoing him as he lost the only acceptable outlet for his sexual desires. Finding a new, acceptable source will take a substantial amount of time due to his unique situation and requirements.

Maybe the mentor will let him use his wife? Hah!

Anonymous said...

Even odds he remarries this year.

Anonymous said...

Is the congregation still "120"? Has it changed at all, up or down? Just wondering.

M said...

I've said this before, but I'm ticked at LE for not releasing better photos right away. Larry Taylor was on a violent criminal binge. Are we to believe that he just stopped on 11/10? If he is responsible for any violent burglaries, rapes or murders after 11/10 - could they have been prevented if a better photo had been released? It's impossible to prove a negative, so we will never know.

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

Anonymous @ 7:32 AM

I'm with you! LOL Maybe we need to start a SA-Anon. LOL Our family was laughing over Christmas as we applied SA with extended family. Word to the Wise: Don't use SA when gift giving and opening presents. ;) One family member said we talk about SA a lot, then asked what Peter had to say about the AB case. LOL She admitted she was hooked and went on to use SA minutes later to "catch" sensitivity in another family member's story. Too funny!
____________________________________________

Happy New Year everyone! Peter, Heather, site moderators and fellow posters- Thanks for making this a good forum for intelligent, lively discussion and learning SA principles. The variety of viewpoints add to the discussion and the majority are expressed civilly and respectfully (unlike many other forums).
____________________________________________
ima.grandma

Good to "see" you! I hope this year is awesome in every way for you. I appreciate your contributions here and enjoy reading them. Take good care of yourself-you are a special lady.

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

rosy- So, essentially you think DB was dumbing it down in an attempt at relevance to a hipster audience? Do you think DB comparing Amanda to Mary was following his usual sermon MO of shock value (minus the gun and sex talk)? Kind of toning it down a notch for the Christmas crowd? In my church experience, we've explored that Mary agreeing to God's plan was a very big deal (especially given the culture, Jewish law, her family & community, her reputation, her mother-child bond to Jesus in the face of his trial and crucifixion, etc.). That's why it should have been even more obvious to anyone in that auditorium that Mary's situation and Amanda's situation were night and day. The only things they had in common were that both women were virgins at marriage, both were pregnant at some point, and both came to recognize Jesus as Savior and Lord. God didn't ask Amanda, a virgin, to bear Jesus. God didn't ask Amanda to die so that Davey could have a 400+ Resonate congregation and become a world-renowned pastor "for Jesus".

So, what exactly is his point here? Somebody? Anybody? I must be missing it. To me it just seems like he's grasping to spiritualize her murder. Religiously obsessed, master manipulator bent on marketing his company, or criminally involved? I'm flabbergasted his congregation seems to be hanging on his word and disturbed that many seem unable to think for themselves. It's pretty sickening that they're attributing godliness to someone so narcissistic and opportunistic. As Peter says, people will tell you who they are if you just listen (and watch, IMO).

Anonymous said...

Foolsfeedonfolly said...
rosy- So, essentially you think DB was dumbing it down in an attempt at relevance to a hipster audience? Do you think DB comparing Amanda to Mary was following his usual sermon MO of shock value (minus the gun and sex talk)? Kind of toning it down a notch for the Christmas crowd? In my church experience, we've explored that Mary agreeing to God's plan was a very big deal (especially given the culture, Jewish law, her family & community, her reputation, her mother-child bond to Jesus in the face of his trial and crucifixion, etc.). That's why it should have been even more obvious to anyone in that auditorium that Mary's situation and Amanda's situation were night and day. The only things they had in common were that both women were virgins at marriage, both were pregnant at some point, and both came to recognize Jesus as Savior and Lord. God didn't ask Amanda, a virgin, to bear Jesus. God didn't ask Amanda to die so that Davey could have a 400+ Resonate congregation and become a world-renowned pastor "for Jesus".

So, what exactly is his point here? Somebody? Anybody? I must be missing it. To me it just seems like he's grasping to spiritualize her murder. Religiously obsessed, master manipulator bent on marketing his company, or criminally involved? I'm flabbergasted his congregation seems to be hanging on his word and disturbed that many seem unable to think for themselves. It's pretty sickening that they're attributing godliness to someone so narcissistic and opportunistic. As Peter says, people will tell you who they are if you just listen (and watch, IMO).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Davey Blackburn surely is doing this to reach a hipster audience. His Pastor, friend, boss, mentor Perry Noble has a cult following in Anderson/Greenville, SC. Local residents are bullied and harassed if they say anything against Newspring. Perry has local media local and federal law enforcement officials who are among his loyal followers.

Perry isn't content to just remain in SC. Noble has handpicked curtain young hip men to spread his form of Christianity to other "church plants" throughout the country who to set up identical shock-jock-cult followers. Davey Blackburns church has the smallest congregation that has been in existence as long as Resonate has. We have a church here in the Philly area that is related to NewSpring that hasn't been in existence near as long as Resonate but not only already has its own building that its already outgrown this building to the point needed to start running 2 morning services. It is not only self-sustaining, but its already sending money BACK to its mothership (Newspring) instead of existing off of it.

One thing that Perry Noble, and his ilk have figured out, is sex-sells even in church. There is no depth or teaching of scripture beyond that.

~C

Pak31 said...

Wow, the last batch of posts here have been great to read through. I'm really freaked out by the July 2008 post before his marriage. I knew he posted that but I didn't realize until now WHEN he did it so it makes it really creepy and yet ONE more "coincidence" to add the list list of many in this case. How can there be so many? Also, I want to just add, even though we all know this, I re-read the news story shortly after the murder that stated LE says DB is 100% cleared in the death of his wife. The article was dated November 12th. It also said that LE wasn't sure if the recent string of robberies in the area is related to Amanda's killing but that DB is cleared because surveillance cameras at LA Fitness shows/proves he was there when Amanda was killed. Seriously? How does that prove anything or clear him 100%? No one has ever been involved in a murder and was at a different location when it occurred? I know it's a news report and could be inaccurate but I doubt it. I'm starting to think that DBs church connections with the higher ups in Indy, the fact that he has a family member who is a reporter I believe and his church member, I wouldn't doubt there could be some type of covering for him. That's the only way he's not being considered. There is no way they could clear him a day later when they didn't even have the suspects arrested yet.

rosy said...

Foolsfeedonfolly said...
Anonymous -C said
at 2:59 PM

I think he focused on the solemnity of Mary's role (traditionally recognized in the church) so as to compare Amanda with her, and he did so as a result of complicated reaction to the murder. He dumbed down (popularized) the traditional reading of Mary's role as you say to make it "relevant" and cool for so-called millennials and for middle aged folks. Hence references to - Pack N Play (do people really buy those?) and to "Home Alone."

As a pastor DB is not an isolated individual he is part of a network with a long tradition. The break-out branch he chose to go into, NewSpring, is one of several in in a movement that aims to make church "cool" for younger generations. They're in a market share battle with traditional churches that are fighting back (including now the Catholic Church under Pope Francis).

Here's an op-ed by an Episcopalian: "Want millennials back in the pews? Stop trying to make church ‘cool.’" Says trendiness is not an answer. "Recent research ... found that 67 percent of millennials prefer a 'classic' church over a 'trendy' one, and 77 percent would choose a 'sanctuary' over an 'auditorium.'... millennials exhibit an increasing aversion to ... closed-minded religious communities masquerading as the hip new places in town."
http://wpo.st/g1U01

Beneath masquerade and in spite of "close-minded" reality some authenticity may survive. I think DB tries hard to deliver "authenticity" by wrapping it in masquerade. Trouble is, not only was he trained up after college in NewSpring, but his own personality is off-kilter in a way that (to me at least) remains as yet unfathomable.

DB is an odd duck judging from his blog entry on Ezekiel in July 2008 three weeks before his wedding. Did he write that entry, at around age 22, out of panic as the wedding day drew near? Why did he put it online? Was he totally unaware that it is odd? Did Amanda read it? Would Amanda's parents have been surprised to read it?

"God killed Ezekiel’s wife so that he could feel the pain that Israel was about to endure! I mean, what the heck! God allowed him to literally feel the weight of what He was going to do to the Israelite people.

I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him."


On November 29, nineteen days after Amanda was killed, virtually the same time interval from Amanda's murder as from his July 8 2008 blog entry to his August 1 wedding day, he sermonized on the death of Ezekiel's wife in his father-in-law's church That is uncanny. It's the work of an unconscious mechanism in his personality.

I would interpret the state of mind in which he took over that podium as unconscious hostility toward father-in-law, payback for arranging their marriage (whether it was arranged or not) when Davey was not ready to marry.

Under the stress of the brutally violent crime perpetrated against Amanda and their unborn child, the stress of finding her bleeding on the floor, and the stress of his own unacknowledged guilt for neglecting Amanda down to leaving the door unlocked and yakking on the phone as she lay dying, Davey jumped the shark. One place he landed was in fantasy back where he was before their wedding. God kills wives so that their husbands can feel pain and step forth as holy prophets in love with Jesus and feeling the pain of the Cross every day.

Davey identifies with bible heroes who lose their wives or never marry - Ezekiel, Stephen, Paul - and above all he believes he is in love with Jesus. To assuage his guilt over suddenly finding himself no longer married, as some deep part of him wanted to remain at age 22, he is envisioning Amanda as a blessed martyr.

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

Kate @ 1:01PM Dec. 31

You said, " Yes, but Davey didn't just walk into a scene showing a wounded wife. She was stripped from the waist down and had her shirt pulled up. There was duct tape right next to her, along with credit cards and a swisher sweet wrapper on the counter. The door was unlocked, thanks to the loving husband.

I've gone through Davey's "sermons" with a fine tooth comb. That man talked non-stop about the crime in Indy, he knew better. Try googling his news clips for Inday prior to Amanda's death. He was well AWARE of the violence and crime in his area, overly aware."
______________________________________
That's a very good point I had not considered. Like most pastors, DB was very aware of crime in the community. Likewise, having substituted and coached youth sports within the school system, he'd have been very aware of the crime-drug-gang culture in the community. As several Indiana-based posters have commented, Indy newscasts are full of crime reports. Davey wasn't exactly small town, leave your doors/vehicles unlocked and your garage doors open. We know locking the door was his normal because he told LE he left the front door unlocked when he left that morning. For most of us, locking the front door when we leave is so routine that it's not memorable (like telling your spouse/children I love you or goodnight- there's no need to mention it). I'm actually a little curious which door he normally leaves by. Is there a garage door leading inside the house?

Bad Juju said...

But if he always leaves the door unlocked, it would be quite easy to remember he'd left it unlocked that morning, right? I don't understand how remembering he left it unlocked indicates that usually did lock it.

My husband occasionally asks me to lock the door when he's leaving if his hands are full or his keys are in his truck, etc. Maybe Davey called out to Amanda to lock the door (and clearly remembers doing so), but she didn't get a chance before the suspects arrived. Who knows.


I will also add that it to a while to get my husband into the habit of locking the door when he leaves. He grew up in a house that was never locked at any hour of the day or night (he never even carried a house key). But we live in a low-crime area, so it's a bit different.

Bad Juju said...

That should say it "took a while." Still getting used to this new tablet, haha.

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

rosy @ 3:39 PM

Lots of food for thought there! Thanks for the info too- I'm not very familiar with the "hipster"/relevant style church.

His return to Ezekiel is an interesting consideration too. Excellent point! Ezekiel 24:15-25 details Ezekiel's wife's death. I don't think Amanda was the delight of Davey's eyes, as Davey seems all about himself (gym, Cubs games, golf, running, etc.). I've known lots of young parents and none have had as much free time to pursue their own interests and hobbies as Davey did, unless they had a full-time paid nanny and a serious income. Same goes for the pastors I've known too. I don't think he's actually identifying with the passage literally -"do not lament or weep or shed a any tears". His near aversion to verbally owning his personal relationship with God makes it hard for me to believe that he knows God/has an authentic relationship with God. Not that he needs to walk, talk, live, and breathe God 24/7 to be authentic, but he actively avoids any 1st person pronoun useage ("I", "my")whenever he discusses God. It's always our God and we.

Ezekiel's wife's death was symbolic of the God destroying the Temple because a wayward Israel took more pride and care in the building than their relationship with God...it was an idol and the symbol of their spiritual prostitution. Thinking this through here, how does this apply to Davey? I don't believe Amanda was his idol, but he may have perceived her that way. He may have perceived her and their unborn child as a threat to his calling. He verbally correlated pregnancy with a marriage stressor (5 things that adversely affect/stress a marriage). He verbally warned other pastors about the effect their choice of wife could have on their ministry career. I'm not saying he killed Amanda or even that he was necessarily involved; only that he consciously or unconsciously twisted the "event" and "series of events" into a God-ordained blessing that elevates Davey in spiritual importance. You are right that he identifies with specific Bible heroes. I think Davey is mentally caught between wanting to be a "free" man like Paul, yet he's struggling with a sexuality issue (per the need for a grown man and pastor to have 2 accountability partners and a have his computer monitored). Using Ezekiel's experience (consciously or subconsciously) gives him some measure of credibility and the allusion of being closer to God than he is. Ironically, the book of Ezekiel addresses exactly what Davey is doing- whitewashing and false prophesying (his shower conversation with God).

I think you may have something that Davey was not ready to get married. I agree it was a hostile takeover of his FIL's podium; as well as commandeering his congregation, insulting them, openly rebuking his FIL, and taking credit for their spiritual growth and good deeds. WOW...just wow! I agree that the marriage was arranged in the sense that Gavin was getting married and so was another of Davey's close friends and he likely felt some pressure. It's also likely Amber and Amanda wanted a double wedding, which may have contributed to any pressure. Davey's career would benefit from a wife and he likely needed a solution for a sexual issue. I think Davey's may be jealous of his FIL's success or perhaps Phil represents everything Davey is not- a godly man, a godly father, faithful to his wife, a successful pastor with a growing congregation, well-positioned financially, etc. Hostility was a very accurate description, rosy!

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

Bad Juju @ 4:20 PM

I understand what you're saying and it does seem a little confusing at first. When your husband leaves the house, do you tell him "Goodbye" or say "I love you"? Likely you do, but you don't have a need to tell someone else that, do you? Another words, because it's your normal, you don't think about it (kind of like a habit). If Davey always left the door unlocked, it would be his habit and would only come to mind if LE specifically asked if he'd locked the door. The statement said Davey stated to LE that he left the door unlocked.

It has taken on added significance because he has failed to take responsibility for leaving the door unlocked and putting his wife, son, and unborn child in danger. He has not stated that he "thought" Amanda would lock the door behind him, "Amanda" was supposed to lock the door behind him, "Amanda" normally locked the door after him, etc. He has neither accepted responsibility nor blamed Amanda. He spoke the truth- he left the door unlocked. Interestingly enough, he has not blamed himself for his personal failure though. Instead of self-condemnation, he quickly and easily attributed Amanda's murder to God's plan for his church to grow and people to come to Jesus because of her televised celebration of life and his interviews; he likened her to centuries of martyrs.

Concerned said...

Fools and rosy,
You have made some excellent points.
Thank you for the time and effort you've spent analyzing Davey's words and actions.

Fools at 5:15 said
"I think you may have something that Davey was not ready to get married. I agree it was a hostile takeover of his FIL's podium; as well as commandeering his congregation, insulting them, openly rebuking his FIL, and taking credit for their spiritual growth and good deeds. WOW...just wow! I agree that the marriage was arranged in the sense that Gavin was getting married and so was another of Davey's close friends and he likely felt some pressure. It's also likely Amber and Amanda wanted a double wedding, which may have contributed to any pressure. Davey's career would benefit from a wife and he likely needed a solution for a sexual issue. I think Davey's may be jealous of his FIL's success or perhaps Phil represents everything Davey is not- a godly man, a godly father, faithful to his wife, a successful pastor with a growing congregation, well-positioned financially, etc. Hostility was a very accurate description, rosy!"

Bad Juju said...

OK I see what you're saying now, Foolsfeedonfolly, but I'm not comfortable assuming that the wording of the document indicates DB volunteered that info without being asked. In the rest of the probable cause document, it doesn't mention anything about what anyone was asked, it just says so-and-so said and so-and-so told the detective, etc. I'm sure the police asked a lot of questions, but none are included in the document if I recall correctly.

However, I would expect him to blame himself for not locking the door, so I agree with what you're saying about that. I did wonder at one point if that was contributing to his "guilty language," but I'm not sure he actually feels any guilt about that. (I still don't think he was involved, though.)

And I think more people would have been brought to Jesus by Amanda herself, alive on this earth, than by her brutal murder, so the whole "martyr" business leaves a bad taste in my mouth, too.

Rabbit said...

foolsfeedonfolly, rosy, concerned and others - thanks so much for yur posts and insight!

And Bad Juju - brilliant comment:

Bad Juju said:

"And I think more people would have been brought to Jesus by Amanda herself, alive on this earth, than by her brutal murder, so the whole "martyr" business leaves a bad taste in my mouth, too."
----------

Indeed and I agree wholeheartedly. I don't understand Davey's brand of religion; since when has it become taboo for a Christian to deny his or her feelings of loss, guilt, mourning and even anger? I see the opposite in my Christian friends and I don't think any less of them. They look to God for solace and comfort. Davey seems to have made his loss into a marketing gain. Look for a book later this year...

Anon "I" said...

Playing the devil's advocate here:

DB's lack of emotion could be because he is trying to adhere to Ezekiel's
instructions as given by God? No mourning, weeping, ashes, just groaning
to express his sorrow.

He and God seem meshed together with the use of "we," why not throw Ezekiel
into the mix? This is going to be one for the history books, right, such
as the world has never seen?

OTOH, no one seems to be mourning like most would expect. Plus, DB was
unusual before Amanda was murdered. God may show up in the shower, but
with Ezekiel along too, things might be getting a little claustrophobic.

....banging my head against the wall....

Bobcat said...

I have a gift here - the Nanny's old blog.

https://megs71385.wordpress.com/

She may delete it, but no worries, I saved the text in searchable form.

Here's an excerpt from December 30, 2008:

"I had a fight with a friend last night. Well we shouldn’t call it a fight we should call it two people disagreeing and refusing to back down from their point of view. It amazes me how stubborn I truly am, amazes and frusturates. I KNEW I was right, I wasn’t asking much, and I was even being 100% honest and still I couldn’t avoid the argument. It just shows you just because you’re 23, and you have bills, a job, and grown up problems we all still argue like 3 year olds in the sandbox. About an hour after I got off the phone I wasn’t as mad at her as I was at myself. IT was stupid, and unresolved, and gave me that sick feeling in my stomach that I may have crossed a line. More than I hate fighting I hate being wrong, I hate admitting I don’t know where I’m going and I hate, hate, hate admitting to a fault. So this is not going to be a post I like…
I am selfish– I constantly put my needs before others. I will take the good seat, I will push to get to the front, I will get up for something to drink and not ask if anyone needs anything.AND, I talk about my self…a lot!
I am stubborn–I will not back down from my opinion, don’t ask me to, because I’m not afraid of an arguement. I am always right and I don’t change for anything short of an earth shattering moment of revelation.
I am lazy–I would rather drive than walk, I would rather wait 15 minutes for a bus than walk for 5 minutes, and I would rather lay in bed till 8:30 than get up at 8 to spend time with God.
I am unforgiving–I will say that I have “forgiven and forgotten” but I can not fully forgive because my ego has been hurt in some way. My pride is bigger than my willingness to love.
After writing this all out, I’m glad that no one really reads my blog. Secretly I hope someone sees this and maybe sees some of themselves in me. I am not these things all the time and I know that I am made whole in Christ, but I am still flesh. It is a daily battle of letting God be seen through the mess that I am. Even more though, letting GOD be seen inspite of my weaknesses.
P.S.-Relient K “which to bury us or the hatchet” is a great song when you are feeling a little angry!!"

rosy said...

Bobcat said...
at 12:30 AM

Thank you!

do you have background or links on Larry T's family?

Concerned said...

Bobcat at 12:30
Quite a find! I've been dying to see statements from Meg!
I wonder if Meg found herself turning 30, single and barely employed, ready to do anything for dear old Davey.
She's selfish, stubborn, lazy, & unforgiving...her words.

I've beat this horse to death but I can't shake feeling that her showing up in Indy and moving in when she did was more than a coincidence. I wish there were Amanda-diary pages discussing Meg but we would never see those, would we?

rosy said...

They're brainwashed. Nothing more or less.

Bobcat said...

rosy - no, nothing on LT.

MG seems very smart, but without fatherly support. What I've gathered is, she has her mother's maiden name as her last name - I have NO CLUE who her bio father is and she never mentions a father. She talks about not getting along with her mother and moving out at 18. Her mother married a stepfather and had three stepsiblings with him.

------

Back to DB:

"His near aversion to verbally owning his personal relationship with God makes it hard for me to believe that he knows God/has an authentic relationship with God."

This reminds me of the grill story video that I watched/transcribed. He rolls his eyes when he talks about being "honest" in church. I wonder if his deception is this. Sure, intellectually he can explain and twist bible stories until the cows come home, but is his heart at peace with God???

Bobcat said...

Rosy, I would try to build a tree on LT, but I'm afraid it might be impossible. I shouldn't generalize, but "families" as loose as his are incredibly difficult to put together.

I can try. Refresh me with his mother's name? Any siblings?

Bobcat said...

Correction - MG's mother married a stepfather and had three HALF siblings with him.

Anonymous said...

What troubles me about Amanda in the train interviews is her worry line that runs down her forward toward her nose. She is far too young to carry that worry wrinkle caused when her eyebrows are pushed to form the distinct worry line. I read it as deep concern, sadness and possibly pain, too. Amanda definitely appears concerned about something troubling her during the Chicago trip.

rosy said...

Anonymous Bobcat said
at 1:05 AM

He may have a birth family and adoptive or foster family. Someone posted along the way a link, or set of numbers, to his record, I didn't know how to use that link.

I got an impression that his parents or father are connected with IMPD, possibly also with a youth support group with volunteer IMPD and church input. If so, this may explain some of the stunned atmosphere at the press conference.

LT's girlfriend (as young and strung out as he is) has a grandfather, a retired Drill Instructor at Department of Corrections in Michigan. He wears a crucifix and may be a pastor. He's an outdoor person, athlete. He post supportive comments on some photos "Nice picture granddaughter, I'm praying for you, Love Grandpa."

Concerned said...

Anon at 1:31
I agree. The image of Amanda from that video is the one I can't shake. No one her age should have such permanent evidence of stress. And this was supposed to be a fun date trip, wasn't it? Yet Davey brought along the sad preacher video that cause tears.

Concerned said...

Do any of you follow the body language analysis of Dr. Lillian Glass? Her blog is a little unnerving with all the typos but she has some interesting thoughts. She hasn't done Davey but I wish she would!

Bobcat said...

Concerned:

Amanda's straight line mouth in the train video reminds me of the straight line mouth of Mary Winkler - another Pastor's wife. I get the sense Amanda knows what she will be asked to submit to that evening and is not looking forward to it.

rosy said...

Is the man on the right in this pic Alonzo?
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=928839707142028&set=ecnf.100000480232787&type=3&theater

On the left, Tray Charles Lynem, FB friend of Larry T's girlfriend. In this photo he says "Swear we KiltGang frfr" (For Real, For Real)

Bobcat said...

Does LT's mom have a facebook?

rosy said...

Bobcat
at 2:52 AM

don't know her name. CJ may have the link I mentioned.

rosy said...

Bobcat


No sign of children - prob. unrelated: Larry Taylor, Community Supervision Manager at Marion County Community Corrections, Armory, S.O.R.T. at Corrections Corporation of America and Transportation Driver at Marion County Jail II.
Studies Criminal Justice at Indiana Wesleyan University
US Marines

Bingo3 said...

Concerned, bringing the Levi video on the romantic getaway was just a little too convenient wasn't it? Who knows if they ever watched it but plugging it in on his twitter feed sure seemed like a calculated move to future action. (like his own book, duh!) And yes she looks very stressed. She nods and tries to smile but she absolutely seems to be carrying a huge burden. The smacking of his lips alone tho would give anyone a headache! And the constant hands flying everywhere like everything he says is of the utmost importance! Oh my!

Bobcat said...

Nanny blog - honesty.

11/21/08
"Honestly, I thought it would fade after the initial excitement of the IDEA, but it’s really begining to play out into my life."

11/26/08
"I have a confession to make…I am addicted to the Twilight books. Two weeks ago I would have said “I’m sure there good, but just not for me”. I gave in, I finally said…”ok I’ll read the first one”. Now I am consumed and torn between wanting to just finish them and wanting them to go on forever. It’s a been a while since I have gotten SO lost in someone else’s world, and I have to say Stephanie Meyers makes her world look good. I finished the first book in 3 days, the second in two. I see a pattern developing and I am afraid to start the third. There is something SO captivating about the love story, it’s an adventure and love and completely intoxicating. This is what I think crack would be like. I didn’t read yesterday, I was incredibly convicted the whole about it. Why is it SO easy for be to pick up one of those books and read for HOURS, hardly moving, waiting to go to the bathroom until I almost burst, and making excuses why I can’t go anywhere until I finish this chapter. Why is that I can’t be this enthralled in the word of God. It’s been killing me, it’s been a struggle I wish I could overcome instantly. It seems simple, but it’s the root of the problem that bothers me. Even if I picked up my Bible and read for four hours straight tonight…I would be making myself, where as NOT picking up Twilight is a struggle of my self control. I am so weak. I desire to be this enthralled by God’s word, I desire to be this captivated by God’s love story. It’s just easier to get drawn in to this fictional love? Now, don’t get me wrong. I like these books a lot. AND, I believe that you can find God’s truth in anything. For instance, God is love, a love story…therefore can be about God. I do think God can be glorified through other books than the Bible, and I do REALLY enjoy reading them. I just struggle with making the desire to become engrossed in God’s word, a reality. It’s always been a struggle, and it’s always been something I have to “make” myself do. This is being incredibly honest, I’m not sure if I should stop. I should just say “I can’t wait to get home and read my Bible everyday!” but that would a lie. I will tell you that I LOVE reading God’s word! Every time I begin reading He reveals Himself to me in new and powerful ways. I do not however, find it easy to set my pride, my shame, and my inadequacies aside long enough to feel eager to read His word. Maybe, it’s because I am afraid of conviction (true). Maybe it’s because I know when I pick up Twilight I can get lost in knowing that it’s not really my love story…it’s not my life (true). Maybe it’s because it’s harder for me to understand how someone could love ME that much, but not hard for me to understand how Edward could love Bella that much. Hmmm…it’s funny how just putting the thoughts out there can reveal something I didn’t even realize."

12/18/08
To be honest my favorite part of Christmas, is not the actual DAY of Christmas, it’s everything leading up.

12/30/08
I KNEW I was right, I wasn’t asking much, and I was even being 100% honest and still I couldn’t avoid the argument.

https://megs71385.wordpress.com/

Bobcat said...

A few more:

6/19/08
It’s been the week from hell. I’m not gonna lie. I’ve been sick, irritable, and just plain discouraged. I was thinking about how much I wanted to find a job that I like (or any job), how much my life has NOT gone like I planned, and just feeling sorry for myself.

9/10/09
The biggest change is that I lost my job. ABSOLUTELY the hardest thing that’s happened to me this year, if not in my life. We won’t dwell though because what God has been doing SINCE that moment has been absolutely MIND BLOWING. ALSO, I have been sick now for about a month, NO lie. Pneumonia will knock you out! I don’t want to talk about that either because, AGAIN, what God is doing in my life is amazing! He has brought me back to that place of desperation for Him, for that absolute NEED for a savior DAILY! I feel as if my walls, my towers, my TEMPLE was destroyed and over the past (almost two) months I have been REBUILDING with ONLY the things God is giving me. I could give you a million reasons why I lost my job. All I know is that it took that to bring me here. There is definitely still pain and loss, there is DEFINITELY still struggles but it makes God THAT much bigger. So much of who I was two months ago was founded in WHAT I did, WHO I worked for, and HOW much I loved my job. None of that had to do with God. Of course, I gave Him all the credit for bringing me there, but my WORK defined me NOT my Jesus. Now, all I have is my Jesus and I have never felt so free.

Bad Juju said...

What is the significance of Meg's 6/7-year-old blog posts?



Here's a great post from Peter about "honestly": http://statement-analysis.blogspot.com/2015/07/honestly-in-statement-analysis.html

"The many variables all require due diligence and not a rush to judgement in deception indication."



Here's another good one:
http://statement-analysis.blogspot.com/2013/01/the-honest-to-god-truth.html

Bobcat said...

The significance would be background for consideration in a possible connection to the orchestration theory.

rosy said...

Meg doesn't understand that religion is not an addiction, not intoxicating, not like crack. NewSpring, HillSong, and Resonate re-addict people for their own purposes.

Bobcat said...

MG fit the perfect profile (single, a little lost, unemployed) for a cult recruit.

rosy said...

DB is sticking with Ezekiel and advising others to go there:

"God will speak to you in the valley. If you're going through one right now, open your ears . . . Ezekiel 3:22 http://buff.ly/1NXoH95
https://twitter.com/daveyblackburn/status/683306546516856832

Anonymous said...

Anonymous Bobcat said...
at 2:13 PM
MG fit the perfect profile (single, a little lost, unemployed) for a cult recruit.
==========

The cult aspect is proclaimed in the title of her blog

Pursuing Surrender
to find or employ measures to obtain or accomplish yielding to the power, control, or possession of another

Anon "I" said...

Good grief! As a Christian, this scares the daylights out of me! Who knows who or what might want to possess her!?! She might want to stipulate that it's God she wants... just sayin'.

rosy said...

With two murder charges, one against a pregnant woman, plus rape, will LT be urged to plea bargain out of the death penalty to life sentences (consecutive or not)? Will the establishment prefer to avoid an open trial? Will this foreclose going further up the chain in the fang hierarchy?

rosy said...

^gang hierarchy, not fang

Anonymous said...

http://www.wthr.com/story/6931121/feds-arrest-22-in-haughville-syndicate

may be of interest to this case. JCC

Anonymous said...

"Harrington, Allen, Calhoun, Williams, Adams, Demarcus Garner, Johnson, Wilson and Eric Garener are accused of associating with Lampkin's lieuteants. They are called 'mid-level' distributors of cocaine for the syndicate. Police say they distributed the cocaine primarily in the Indianapolis metro area but also sold cocaine to customers from Bloomington and Lafayette, Indiana and the counties surrounding Marion County.

McMiller, Furr and Smith are accused of acting as an alternate source of supply of cocaine for the mid-level distributors in the conspiracy." quoted from website listed above. JCC

Hey Jude said...

Pursuing Surrender
to find or employ measures to obtain or accomplish yielding to the power, control, or possession of another

---

Bobcat - is that something she is quoting, or something she I saying? That really doesn't sound like a spiritual goal - 'of another' is not sufficient to mean God, it seems she is thinking of a person.

I wonder, are there any indications, subtle or overt, that she was looking for a Master-Slave type relationship or has BDSM interests? Does she say she doesn't want to go out to work, she loves homemaking, and wants a man to wait on and worship, sort of thing, however put? Some people enter into master-slave contracts, and (read no further sensitive Christian souls) there is a fringe Christian BDSM 'scene'. Most 'respectable' Christians would be unaware of it.

A glimpse of the scariness of such for a submissive wife whose husband has or develops such an interest - it's safe to visit, it's a prayer board:

http://www.christian-prayers.com/message-board-forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3997

Consenting adults, on the other hand, that's their business.

What MG wrote there is interesting; she isn't thinking of God, she isn't thinking of community. Does she go on to write about God? If so, it might be entirely unintended leakage of her sexual interests - but it sounds like putting it out there, to me - in which case none too shy, is she? Lol.

Intern, bib and jockstrap errand runner, live-in person till chucked out, sometime baby-sitter, currently serving as Davey's water girl. Hmm.

I'd like to see Davey's web-browsing history from this time last year, and know what his interests might be. I dunno, these hip Christians, and their preoccupation with sex. In fairness, hers is an old blog, and she would have been very young when she wrote that stuff. Did she even know Davey back then?

---

I'll probably be quite relieved if no-one is still reading this thread. :)

Hey Jude said...

An Indiana case - Husband-Wife Slave Contract

http://www.rawstory.com/2014/09/indiana-man-accused-of-raping-and-abusing-wife-after-forcing-her-to-sign-slave-contract/

rosy said...

For more than you need to know abiut who she thought she was back then, check out


About
Music, Movies, FOOTBALL season, things that make me laugh, rainy days, GOD, love, butterflies, getting the good parking space.... watching scary movies, learning new things about God.

And too much more

https://megs71385.wordpress.com/about/

rosy said...

Anonymous JCC said...
at 8:19 PM

http://www.wthr.com/story/6931121/feds-arrest-22-in-haughville-syndicate

may be of interest to this case.
================

The Haughville syndicate story is undated but it comes from Aug. 14 2007. DO you have information to link this with current events>

Haughville is one of the most notorious tough neighborhood in Indy. A follow up events (shootings) is discussed here:
Thursday, January 17, 2008
Hovey Street Mother & Child Tied To Haughville Syndicate
http://advanceindiana.blogspot.com/2008/01/hovey-street-mother-child-tied-to.html

As of As of February 11, 2008 authorities were still looking for Mario Adams, Dawan Calhoun, Jonathan Furr, David Harrington, Jarvis Watson, and Antjuan Jefferson.
http://www.wibc.com/blogs/6-still-wanted-haughville-syndicate-investigation

Update on the neighborhood - not happy
http://parachute.mapquest.com/2015/11/05/worst-places-to-visit-in-indianapolis/

Bingo3 said...

I loved Amber's post about her sister on FB. She talks specifics about Amanda's life revolving around her home. How she kept a beautiful, warm, cozy home. How she made people feel valued, the conversations she had with people in her living room. How she bought her guests their favorite snacks, put pictures around her house of those she loved. How she radiated warmth and love,etc. She just gave the best tribute to her sister revolving around the home she kept. At the end she says, "I love you so much."

It was in such deep contrast to anything D has said about Amanda! His was such a move on attitude! The only thing he has said about her life is that she loved Jesus and she was the best mom and wife. She loved Jesus so much she would be totally ok with her brutal murder because people will be saved because of it!! No specifics at all that I have heard about her life here on earth! He seemed in such a hurry to move on, she is heaven now, time for the revival of epic proportions! Let's get those t-shirts printed, make sure I advertise my church in her obituary, quickly change her FB page to remembering Amanda. Let's have church service as planned, come to the celebration service tho in the afternoon, wear jeans, bring friends and buy a t-shirt! No honoring and remembering her life specifics like her sister has been doing! So not normal especially when compared to a person who obviously truly did love Amanda!

Hey Jude said...

Rosy - whilst considering Amanda's murder, and the possibility it was orchestrated, we probably can't know too much about a person who was not only close to Amanda, Davey and Weston, but who followed them to Indiana, lived in their home, posted pictures of Weston labelled 'I love you' on her Instagram, and mentioned Amanda's death in the same post in which she announced the sale of her #nothing is wasted goods. They'd all agree, it would be a shame to waste a good blog,

'Pursuing Surrender
to find or employ measures to obtain or accomplish yielding to the power, control, or possession of another'

Some interests develop over the years, while others are grown out of - sexual preferences are set deep in the psych. What she wrote there caught my interest. If I can get it (pesky iPad doesn't like text links) I'll be interested to see if she wrote anything else which might support the idea that in posting that she was advertising an interest, either knowingly or unknowingly. If she was, that might lend strength to others' views that she may have been offering Davey something that Amanda was not. I hadn't given that much consideration until now, but having seen her expressed purpose in life at that time, it could be what she is still like, and about.

It's been remarked that Davey has a sadistic streak at least - If he is a sexual sadist he will appreciate a masochist. Amanda was spiritually submissive but it doesn't follow that she would also be sexually submissive - even if she was, that need not have extended to an appreciation of sado-masochism. Davey has told us repeatedly that his issues are around sex, and Amanda did not fulfil his needs - we also know she tried, but there was conflict, and upset about his browsing habits.

A sadist who wants a slave to control, punish and humiliate is not going to be too interested in dinner dates, diffused lighting, scented candles, elevator music, nor even, necessarily, sex, much less anything to which HE needs to submit - if he wanted to be Master, and if his interest is BDSM, everything would need to be on his terms. As an indicator, his dark stark Resonate stage, and the relentless 'you will submit' music is the preferred setting for his bullying superior self and style.

Say Amanda would not be the type of submissive he wanted - it's likely there would have been little to no sex life. I don't suggest he forced his preferences on her, more that the relationship would have been angst ridden if he could not get his way; Amanda would be 'controlling' him, which would be intolerable if he had entered marriage imagining it on any level to be something of a Master-Slave relationship which did not materialise. Rather than acknowledge incompatible desires, he might see refusal of his desires as Amanda putting herself on the moral high ground, judging and disdaining him. His narcissism would prevent him from seeing things from Amanda's point of view - he would not easily accept that to decline that sort of activity would not be against him, but for her.

In the wings, meanwhile, stands Meg, all of a desperation to be under the power, control and possession of another (seemingly not God, unless she is woefully ill-informed and theologically illiterate) - a would-be Master's dream; let's not forget how excited she was over the jock-strap errand, even reposting it years later. Outside of a slave-master thing, that is beyond weird and embarrassing and takes inappropriate to a whole new level - she even made that a public post. It could just have been a joke, though I can't see Amanda would have been amused, and do find it curious that she tweeted 'Kill Jezebel!' about Meg - even if that was a joke, there's often more to a joke than appears.

Still, I need to see what Meg wrote in context, so often an inconvenient friend, along with running away with myself.

Bobcat said...

Hey Jude:

The Pursuing Surrender and definition is the title of her blog.

She doesn't talk about relationships much - other than enjoying the fantasy love in the Twilight books.

She also mentions praying for her future husband once, shortly after attending a wedding.

6/25/08
"Another thing I’ve started doing is praying for my future husband. I know it sounds stupid now, but one of my friends mentioned it once and it’s been on my heart ever since. I have faith in God and I have faith that He will fulfill the desires of my heart. I pray that my desires are His, daily, and I so I think I should pray for my future husband. I pray that he is growing closer to Christ everyday. I pray that he is becoming the spiritual leader I desire and need in my life. I pray that he is staying pure and that he respects women. Just some things that have been on my mind lately."

Bingo3 said...

In Sunday School today, one of my classmates spoke up and said he was really having a hard time with his faith right now. One of his best friends died in his sleep at the age of 48 due to a sudden heartache. The man's son found him on Christmas morning. He said "Honestly, I am very mad at God right now. Not that I don't know He is still God but I am mad right now and I can't help it." I immediately thought about DB case. That in my opinion is a very normal, human response. He didn't announce that Nothing is Wasted and The Best is Yet to Come. He is mourning and right now everything is not ok and it may not be for a very long time.

Bobcat said...

Jude - interesting ideas. Do you know anything about the relationships in the Twilight books? Following is MGs blog post about how much she loved reading them - a LOT more than reading the bible!

11/26/08
"I have a confession to make…I am addicted to the Twilight books. Two weeks ago I would have said “I’m sure there good, but just not for me”. I gave in, I finally said…”ok I’ll read the first one”. Now I am consumed and torn between wanting to just finish them and wanting them to go on forever. It’s a been a while since I have gotten SO lost in someone else’s world, and I have to say Stephanie Meyers makes her world look good. I finished the first book in 3 days, the second in two. I see a pattern developing and I am afraid to start the third. There is something SO captivating about the love story, it’s an adventure and love and completely intoxicating. This is what I think crack would be like. I didn’t read yesterday, I was incredibly convicted the whole about it. Why is it SO easy for be to pick up one of those books and read for HOURS, hardly moving, waiting to go to the bathroom until I almost burst, and making excuses why I can’t go anywhere until I finish this chapter. Why is that I can’t be this enthralled in the word of God. It’s been killing me, it’s been a struggle I wish I could overcome instantly. It seems simple, but it’s the root of the problem that bothers me. Even if I picked up my Bible and read for four hours straight tonight…I would be making myself, where as NOT picking up Twilight is a struggle of my self control. I am so weak. I desire to be this enthralled by God’s word, I desire to be this captivated by God’s love story. It’s just easier to get drawn in to this fictional love? Now, don’t get me wrong. I like these books a lot. AND, I believe that you can find God’s truth in anything. For instance, God is love, a love story…therefore can be about God. I do think God can be glorified through other books than the Bible, and I do REALLY enjoy reading them. I just struggle with making the desire to become engrossed in God’s word, a reality. It’s always been a struggle, and it’s always been something I have to “make” myself do. This is being incredibly honest, I’m not sure if I should stop. I should just say “I can’t wait to get home and read my Bible everyday!” but that would a lie. I will tell you that I LOVE reading God’s word! Every time I begin reading He reveals Himself to me in new and powerful ways. I do not however, find it easy to set my pride, my shame, and my inadequacies aside long enough to feel eager to read His word. Maybe, it’s because I am afraid of conviction (true). Maybe it’s because I know when I pick up Twilight I can get lost in knowing that it’s not really my love story…it’s not my life (true). Maybe it’s because it’s harder for me to understand how someone could love ME that much, but not hard for me to understand how Edward could love Bella that much. Hmmm…it’s funny how just putting the thoughts out there can reveal something I didn’t even realize.
Anyways, read the books. Keep an open mind, but search for God in everything. Maybe that’s the lesson here…or maybe it’s just fun to get lost in someone else’s world :) I definitely think so!"

Bobcat said...

I suspect that MG was turned on by the beautiful Edward in the Twilight series. DB is almost as pretty - I can imagine her silently desiring her "beautiful" (yet married) "boss."

Hey Jude said...

Bobcat - I don't know the 'Twilight' books, I know of their addictive draw, as one of my son's girlfriends of yore was similarly addicted to them. I should have shown more interest, but I have an aversion to anything which is too popular. I'll find a synopsis later.

Interesting that she finds the need to tell us she denied herself the bathroom for hours - that's a master-slave thing - she could have been fantasising. See the news article I posted earlier - it's all about the duct tape, or can be. I'd mark that up as a signal - she's maybe hoping her future husband is reading her blog. Interesting - she knows she's 'putting thoughts out there' which can reveal something she didn't realise.

The prayer about her future husband - well that would fit with wanting someone who was also into the master-slave thing, but also with her being aware there can be a fine line between where consent ends and abuse begins in that type of relationship.

Well, it can be fun to get lost in someone else's world, but I don't want to get (too) lost in what I think might be Megan's world.


Hey Jude said...

PS - as the TITLE of her blog, well, I think that has got to be a clue - she was a girl on a mission, :)

Bobcat said...

Interesting photo from MG's Nothing Is Wasted shop:

https://www.facebook.com/nothingiswasted/photos/pcb.1604988639722229/1604988376388922/?type=3&theater

She loved to read! Contrast that with DB's mocking post of Amanda not being well-read.

MG was a fan of Harry Potter and the Hunger Games. Other titles on the shelf:
Mrs. Poe - about a mistress.
Whistling past the Graveyard
Tina Fey Bossypants

Hey Jude said...

I see Schindler's List, Jane Austen's 'Emma', Dickens' 'Great Expectations' - but mostly those signs which I would waste right away -she could Google 'Eric Gill' and find something beautiful to emulate (his scripts, not his life).

Hey Jude said...

I read Oprah's 101 on 'Twilight' - I'm so depressed. All those kids wasting all those hours on what looks like trash, to me. I'm biased, I don't like vampire stories.

Spiritual vampires are interesting, but it would be too great and unkind a leap or connection to make.

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

Anonymous said... @10:21 AM Nov. 15, 2015

"So what I’m learning is that I want all the benefits of a Godly, successful, and disciplined life, but I don’t want to go through the pain, suffering, and hard work that is involved.

Ezekiel had an incredible relationship with God, but he went through a ton of crap in order to be that close with Him (see Ezekiel 3:1-2, 4:4-8, 5:1, 24:15-24). God killed Ezekiel’s wife so that he could feel the pain that Israel was about to endure! I mean, what the heck! God allowed him to literally feel the weight of what He was going to do to the Israelite people.

I want THAT kind of relationship with Jesus, but it scares me to death to think about taking up THIS cross every day in order to be THAT kind of follower of Him.

-Davey Blackburn" November 25, 2015 at 10:21 AM

Bingo 3 @ 8:47 said...

"It was in such deep contrast to anything D has said about Amanda! His was such a move on attitude! The only thing he has said about her life is that she loved Jesus and she was the best mom and wife. She loved Jesus so much she would be totally ok with her brutal murder because people will be saved because of it!! No specifics at all that I have heard about her life here on earth! He seemed in such a hurry to move on, she is heaven now, time for the revival of epic proportions! Let's get those t-shirts printed, make sure I advertise my church in her obituary, quickly change her FB page to remembering Amanda. Let's have church service as planned, come to the celebration service tho in the afternoon, wear jeans, bring friends and buy a t-shirt! No honoring and remembering her life specifics like her sister has been doing! So not normal especially when compared to a person who obviously truly did love Amanda!"

rosy @ 3:39 PM Jan. 1, 2106 said....
Davey identifies with bible heroes who lose their wives or never marry - Ezekiel, Stephen, Paul - and above all he believes he is in love with Jesus. To assuage his guilt over suddenly finding himself no longer married, as some deep part of him wanted to remain at age 22, he is envisioning Amanda as a blessed martyr.
___________________________________________________________________

So, Davey's wife is murdered and he begins acting like Ezekiel. Judging from Davey's post, he equates Ezekiel as being "more holy/more righteous"/"honored'/ "tight with God"(hipster speak), that God took his wife and is thereby making him a renowned prophet. Suffice to say, IF Davey's not involved, he either actually views this a gift from God (a seal of approval for him) or he's parlaying into such.

The problem is, Ezekiel's experience is situation-specific to Israel, as God's bride (Ezekiel 33:21-33) and their unfaithfulness to God. Resonate Church is not Israel.

The second problem is that Resonate is not growing as was expected/projected regardless of marketing gimmicks, promotion (FOR INDY, t-shirts,post-it-note blitzes,media coverage & interviews),planning strategies, targeted outreach programs, and its un-church hipster-style hyped services...unlike his peers, idols, and mentor...generating a high degree of personal/emotional/mental/professional stress and economic uncertainty. Davey's ministry needed a slingshot, a jump-start, and quickly.

Frankly,I'm leaning toward involvement with the unlocked door and this passage prior to marriage and Davey himself revisiting it. Unlike Davey, God told Ezekiel in advance what the plan was. I believe Amanda's murder was supposed to occur with the prophetic one blow (a la Ezekiel's wife), but it didn't come off that way. IMO, this points to premeditation. The 911 call, as well as Davey's actual statements to LE (not the released Probable Cause doc), I think will be key. Like The Baker's Dozen, I think hints were dropped to the right people.

rosy said...

"Wow!! Jesus saved 8 more people @resonateindy today and @zwoolie was 🔥🔥!! I love my church!!"

@zwoolie is Zach Woolever, grew up in S Carolina, indoctrinated in NewSpring's Gauntlet ad Fuse programs. Now lives in Indianapolis (?). NOw married.

In this video he says he's going to share his wife's story, but boy does he get off on telling his own story first while she (LAuren) peeks at him adoringly. He's an athlete! Not as great as he might have wanted to be but he was popular and a ton of girls liked him! He struggled with depression for 2 years in high school, "lived in darkness." And this was cured by NewSpring!

ZAch got invited by "this crazy guy" Davey Blackburn to go to the Gauntlet (NewSpring Bible camp at Daytona Beach)

Cut to the chase, Zach says it was to all to the good the his best friend committed suicide (in 2012) because at the funeral 2 people came up to him and suggested he should go into the ministry.

The best is yet to come, yada yada. Their "story" video was made in March 2015. He will convert you through the video if you want.
https://youtu.be/WChV0REu8XU

Hey Jude said...

Anon 'I' said -
Good grief! As a Christian, this scares the daylights out of me! Who knows who or what might want to possess her!?! She might want to stipulate that it's God she wants

----

We can't say it for her? She writes continuously about God, and she knows what she intends to say and convey - so it's curious that she should choose to make the 'another' of her blog title quite so ambiguous. Enough to scare the daylights out a Christian - or not, depending on what anyone might read into 'another'. She thinks most will take it to mean God, she also knows some people who will read it differently, perhaps. People think carefully about their blog titles, - she's bright, and she thinks a lot, so I would tend towards intentional ambiguity.

Anonymous said...

Where's ABB?? I miss her!!

Foolsfeedonfolly said...

rosy- Thanks for posting the above. Sad to see that it's still about performance, not people.

I really hate when so-called pastors make comments like "@zwoolie was [hot/smoking]". Who's getting the credit- God or Zach? Jesus just gets the obligatory lip service. It's really about the guy on stage, his performance and his numbers- pride and bragging rights. Sickening.

NewSpring's model is no different than certain denominational pastors who go to Divinity school and all wear the same type of suit. They put on their "Pastor-ness" as they step up on the stage/up to the podium/behind the pulpit (Cookie cutter Christian syndrome). They look the same, they sound the same (same inflections and mannerisms). Their funerals all have the same verbiage, following a rote memorization script, no matter what city or town you're in across the country.

Contrast that to down-to-earth Jesus, with no Doctorate of Divinity, no ministry training and credentials, no fancy get-up, no auditorium/elaborate building with sound system/lighting system/audio-video equipment, no IT team, no multi-level marketing books, no props- Yet he had no problem drawing crowds wherever he went-crowds willing to sit on the ground, in the hot sun from early morning to sunset.

I'll step down off my soapbox now. ;)

Bobcat said...

I found another old blog. This one only has a few posts by DB in relation to SWU baseball.

http://swubaseball.blogspot.com/

In 2008, talking about teams, DB uses the words "whatever it takes" but adds a disclaimer (within ethical constraints):

-------------------------------

"Ok so how is a team successful? There are so many characteristics of successful teams but I believe there are certain components that are a "must have." Many people would say you have to have team chemistry. I don't really agree with that. I've been on successful teams that don't necessarily have team chemistry, but they were successful. Now does that mean team chemistry is not important - absolutely not. Team chemistry is definitely an important aspect of most successful teams. But there are so many successful business teams out there that hate each other's guts outside of work but between 9-5 they strap in and work their tails off because they have the same end goal in mind.

Every team member MUST be looking at the same goal and striving to achieve that goal. At the end of the day the team doesn't necessarily have to like each other, as long as the team is all pushing and pulling in the same direction. Fortunately for us, SWU Baseball has incredible team chemistry. There is hardly anyone that doesn't like or respect someone else on the team. I've talked to several of our transfers who have played on several different teams and they have told me that this is THE closest knit team they have ever played on.

But what about our goal? Are we all on the same page trying to accomplish the same thing? Most of the time I think we are. But striving toward our goal ON THE FIELD is directly affected by what we are striving for OFF THE FIELD - academically, socially, spiritually, etc. A successful team locates the obstacles that could potentially get in the way and they either avoid them or confront them. Either way, successful teams let nothing drag them off course.

I talked to a couple guys yesterday who were part of a ministry team in Seneca, SC but after 9 years their team crumbled. The only thing they could attribute it to was that they lost sight of the goal, and when they tried to correct the steering wheel, it was too late. My heart grieves for them. Here are three or four guys who have invested their entire lives into a dream and it's all come crashing down leaving them with nothing.

It is imperative that teams have the same goal in mind and do whatever it takes (within ethical constraints) to accomplish that goal."

-------------------------------------

So a few years on, ethical constraints are no longer an issue? Whatever it takes, no disclaimer?

_________________________

Another quote - can someone explain what butt-ripping means in the context of baseball practice?

"This weekend, after some butt-ripping, running, and hard work I think we're ready to begin playing like we know we should."

Bingo3 said...

Hey Jude I think possibly you are on to something in regard to Amanda and how she wasn't quite doing everything he said and following his every command. Although ingrained in submissiveness as a Christian wife, she also seemed like an intelligent strong person. Also, people were most likely drawn to her than him because she actually cared about other people. I think he started resenting all of the above. Then along comes a weaker person, one who almost seems lost. She is probably enamored with him and it feeds his ego. She will do anything he asks and will submit to him. (although not sure it is a romantic thing on his side just an ego thing) She is thrilled to bring him his water bottle and buy him his jock straps and fade back into his glory. I have seen this happen with someone close in my life not as a murder but certainly a replacement. If you are a narcissitis only the people who stroke your ego, become interested in only what interests you and live behind your spotlight stay in your life.

Unknown said...

Someone on the Facebook page wrote to Perry Noble, this is her letter and the response:

"Wrote to perry Noble asking how his church felt about DB, his character as a Christian pastor. I was surprised that I got any reply at all but it was typical of what I expected when I received an answer . Honestly I didn't think Noble would want to say anything other than what he provided here but wanted to test the waters so to speak. Notice that Noble thought it important enough to reply asap, a little-taking care of media control business? for lack of other words...

Hey Tania,
My name is Madi and I work on staff with Perry at NewSpring Church. At the moment Perry is on stage preaching our 11:15 service, however he has asked that I reach back out to you as quickly as possible on his behalf. Thank you so much for reaching out with your concerns. Davey has many godly men around him that keep him accountable in all areas of his life. Again, we appreciate your concern and hope you have a great day.
Thanks,
-Madi
--
Office of Perry Noble
NewSpring Church
www.newspring.cc
864.965.9548
perrynoble.com | Twitter | Facebook | Instagram"

Unknown said...

... the poster wrote back:

"So I sent another message to Madi, Noble's secretary asking about the jockstrap/Megs G and how that's accountable? We shall see if any reply is sent.............have to go get laundry done and will post later if a reply is forthcoming from Madi or Noble."

Neither Noble nor Maddi responded yet...

Unknown said...

Very interesting that it's implied Madi (gal on PN's staff) connected with PN during the service and that the emailer's question was of such Importance, it deserved a response while PN was still on stage preaching. Hmmmm....

-JML

mom2many said...

PN and co. didn't really answer the question, did they?

Pak31 said...

Just an interesting observation. Today I was reading a story about how missing country singer Craig Stickland was found deceased after his boat capsized last week. His wife posted on social media the whole time he was missing which seemed odd but not unusual for today's youth. So he was found today and yesterday she posted a picture of herself(mind you he was still missing at this point) and all the men were somber looking yet she's smiling like she was at a party. Then she posted a picture of her smiling with her dog who survived the boat accident. Her posts were also very biblical like Daveys. I couldn't believe her attitude and lack of sadness. Many of the posters on the site I was on were appalled at her lack of grief and emotion. If someone took my picture while I was waiting to hear of my husbands fate I wouldn't be in full make up hamming with others. I just wonder if people who are this religious just feel that life goes on after death and they aren't sad. If I didn't know better, I would think she was behind his death. Maybe DB is just so far gone that he's devoid of emotion and has no fear of death.

Bottle Cap said...

Pak31, I just came here to post the same thing. Here's the link to her Instagram posing with the searchers while her husband was missing for a week and his friend had already been found dead. https://www.instagram.com/p/BAGV-pXHZAd/
Here's her posing with her girlfirends in a staged photo
https://www.instagram.com/p/_-aXsGHZO4/?taken-by=helenelizabethstrickland

Bottle Cap said...

Sloane, what a bizarre response from Madi.
- The timing, as Perry is on stage
- Davey has godly men surrounding him to keep him accountable
- She didn't say Davey was godly or accountable, only the men around him
Not an endorsement of Davey by any means

Hey Jude said...

Translation:

'Davey is a cause of much concern, so we're trying not to let him out of our sight. Please don't ask us about jock-straps or Megs; we are unable to dignify such prurient enquiries with a Noble response'. #nothingiswasted #internsrus

Bingo3 said...

This has probably been talked about already but doesn't it bother you guys not only the cray-cray "Worship as a Weapon" sermon two days before Amanda was shot (not to mention his dilated eyes as he preached the sermon). The thing that bothered me even more than the sermon is that someone posted it to the Resonate website on the 19th AFTER Amanda was shot and killed. You DON'T post a video of a gun being used in the sermon after the pastors wife was killed by a gunshot wound. Such insensitivity! I am not sure who posted it, but shame on them!

Hey Jude said...

That would be Davey, or under his instruction, Bingo. You can be sure he is Resonate's social media, and probably also the website; the donation page was up like a flash, and arranged that no running total was visible - that takes a bit of research and organising - no GoFundMe for Davey; a kind hearted person who set one up was asked to suspend it - he wanted those donations to keep flowing directly, and without needing to give any indication of how much was being raised (Davey doesn't think he should need to be too accountable in anything, methinks).

Most people who stated an opinion found it at best insensitive for the 'Worship as a Weapon' sermon to be uploaded, while Davey sees it as providing public confirmation of his prophetic powers - there is no other reason for it still to be on the website. It was intended, in my opinion - we're meant to see how closely the sermon ties in with what happened to Amanda. I see that, but put it down to pre-planning on his part rather than to Davey's non-existent 'prophetic' powers. I wouldn't even like to be able to believe that any of what happened had anything to do with God (strange he seems to think people will react with 'ah, yes, of course - that's just what our loving God is like') -I think rather Davey has made God in his own image, as people commonly do - Davey's 'God' gives some insight into Davey. A bit of a schemer who finds Amanda's life to be disposable - she needs to die, and that most horribly, to grow Davey's failing church. Davey's 'God' also pops into the shower just to make sure Davey is going to be 'obedient' in relaying that message in his father (in law's) church, no matter how out of order that is. That's how I see it, anyway. Davey himself doesn't leave much room for the possibility of a random attack - as far as he is concerned, it was all 'God's' plan. Davey, we are meant to marvel, is is just being faithful and strong in accepting his lot in life; poor Davey, such faith, such strength, etc.

There was a fair bit of discussion on the earlier threads - I don't remember which ones.

Hey Jude said...

On Twitter he's going on about being surrounded by a cloud of witnesses - quoting Hebrews 12.1. Worrying about his alibis, perhaps -and despising the shame.

rosy said...

Hey jude said...
at 2:45 PM
On Twitter he's going on about being surrounded by a cloud of witnesses - quoting Hebrews 12.1
-----------
I don't think he's worrying about alibis, or not directly. The witnesses, in Hebrews 11, are all favorable - the patriarchs and Moses and the prophets. And they, according to the text, are not so blessed as are Christian believers.

"And all these, having gained approval through their faith, did not receive what was promised, 40 because God had provided something better for us, so that apart from us they would not be made perfect."

The next verse in 12 (under Do Not Grow weary in ESV) says "Consider him who endured from sinners such hostility against himself, so that you may not grow weary or fainthearted." Perhaps in DB's mind this applies to hostility toward himself. Chapter 12 goes on to say, accept the "discipline" that lies ahead. The Tweet seems to be addressed to staff or some group of others -- "Cmon! 👊🏻👊🏻 " Anyone know what the symbol is?

Perhaps his Tweet is made to encourage some weary souls on his staff. the weary

rosy said...

Is Larry Taylor due to appear in court tomorrow January 6?

Bobcat said...

Rosy

"Cmon! �������� " Anyone know what the symbol is?

-------

They look like two fists. Go team!

rosy said...

If any one has yet to read the probable cause for Taylor and Watson Dec 3 (this is the redacted copy via Indy Star, I've not seen the un-redacted): https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2649018/Larry-Taylor-Jalen-Watson-Sexual-assault-Dec-2015.pdf

rosy said...

^^^ November 3

Hey Jude said...

Rosy, it'll be on his mind - his friend on the phone will have heard whatever Davey heard. His friend on the phone might not be quite on message. His friend on the phone made an uncharacteristic tweet on the morning of the murder. Either Davey asked him to tweet, or for some reason the friend was concerned enough about the phone call to tweet that there had been one. All Davey and Amanda's friends and family are witnesses, in the sense that they may have information about the marriage that he is worried about, or about Davey, particularly in the weeks leading up to the murder. Some will know why Megs moved out, Davey may not know who knows what, or what Amanda might have said, or who is, or has been, expressing any concerns to LE.

Davey is interested primarily in himself, though he could be trying to encourage others to 'despise' the shame he is causing them, I suppose.

rosy said...

Hey Jude said...
at 6:15 PM
=============

You're thinking abut this more closely that I was. You may be right. I was considering the scriptural context, you're considering reasons for choosing it.

rosy said...

Correction to January 6 above -- "A pretrial conference for Taylor and Watson is scheduled for Jan. 8, 2016."
That was as of Nov 23.

M said...

Rosy - Feb 5

You can find this information on mycase.in.gov

There are so many Larry Taylors that you'll need to narrow the search to Marion County. On the first page, click the drop down box and then click on Marion County.

Then right below that click on "Criminal & Citation Case Records."
On the next screen, enter the characters you see to prove that you are not a robot.
Click on 'Search By' and select 'Defendant.'
Enter Larry Taylor in the appropriate boxes.
You can skip all of the rest of the blanks. Go to the bottom of the page and click on 'Search.'
Scroll to the bottom of that page of results. I think it will be obvious to you which ones are the correct Larry Taylor based on the dates and charges.

rosy said...

M said ...
at 7:53 PM

Thanks. I blve I've used that once before.
do you know how to find his parents?

rosy said...

October 5 2015, Maykayla Mitchell age 18 and her friend Coriana Johnson age 17 were shot to death on the West side by 20th St in their vehicle. This is one of the scores of unsolved crime from last year. Anyone know if Maykayla was related to Donae M? MAykayla was friends with her and Alonzo and with some others we've mentioned here.

rosy said...

Taylor's pretrial conference on November 10 charges was reset by Court from 01/08/2016 to 02/05/2016. This same date is set for pretrial conferences for the other crimes (Nov 3 and 4).

Hey Jude said...

Rosy - thanks. I noticed you were context intensive - I don't think Davey is nearly so conscientious, and would just post whatever came to mind because it was on his mind, especially in a tweet where it's all free editing and random. He's much the same with his sermons, so it's Davey's personal context, rather than the factual context of his scripture choices, which is at play - he leaks continually. If he does give setting and context in his sermons, as he tried in his Christmas sermon to do, it's as a necessary chore - he can't wait to get to his 'real' points or message, whereas for you I think it's a pleasure to put things into context and explain things - chore or pleasure, it comes across.
I think it's a form of projection - we all do it to a greater or lesser degree - Peter writes about it quite often.

Bingo3 said...

From Hey Jude: That would be Davey, or under his instruction, Bingo. You can be sure he is Resonate's social media, and probably also the website; the donation page was up like a flash, and arranged that no running total was visible - that takes a bit of research and organising - no GoFundMe for Davey; a kind hearted person who set one up was asked to suspend it - he wanted those donations to keep flowing directly, and without needing to give any indication of how much was being raised (Davey doesn't think he should need to be too accountable in anything, methinks) and without needing to give any indication of how much was being raised (Davey doesn't think he should need to be too accountable in anything, methinks).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wowsa Hey Jude! If CD is really the one who decided to go ahead and post that gun video then that may be one of the most insensitive sinister things I have seen in this case! AND shutting down the GoFundMe page! Say whaaaa??? He wanted it all tax free I see and unaccounted for indeed! Sure didn't put it toward trying to catch the murderers.

Bingo3 said...

Since CD did not care a thing about upping the reward money and begging for any information about catching the horrible murderers AND showed absolutely NO fear that they were still out there, don't we assume he knew who they were already. If so was the reward just what they got from the empty house robbery attempt (if he clued them in to the person working at night?)or does he still owe them something?

Hey Jude said...

Bingo - how did you form the opinion that Davey knows and might owe money to whoever killed Amanda? I don't know how you got there - what is the basis - what has he said, specifically, to create that impression?

I can see he might have 'orchestrated' it through suggestion, to various people, but I can't see there's anything to support that he hired and paid someone he knew to kill Amanda. I also think he would not be able to justify a blatantly criminal act to himself as 'God's will' - it would be easier if he could convince himself that he had no idea anyone would react as they did to whatever they heard him say, second or third hand, and take it upon themselves to rid him of Amanda. He could believe it was a misunderstanding - a bit like King Henry muttering in frustration 'who will rid me of this turbulent priest?' - he didn't anticipate that some of his dim-witted knights would take it upon themselves to murder his temperamental friend the Archbishop, Thomas Becket, assuming that was what Henry's outburst required. Any similarity ends there as Henry was genuinely horrified and heartbroken. He might have been 'responsible' in a sense, but no-one could say he ordered or intended for Becket to die, rather his knights over interpreted and mistook his frustration for an intention.

Bingo3 said...

Hey Jude, you don't think someone higher up in the gang got some sort of payment? You think maybe it was just orchestrated as robbery, gang initiation type thing? I am convinced CD hands were all in this and I assumed he had to pay someone something to make it happen. One of my many theories and thoughts was that Larry Taylor, dead man walking, loose cannon was left there to do what they knew he would do. The other two will rat him out and serve shorter sentences. LT never knew it was setup as a hit. He was also drunk and possible stoned and says he has not recollection of what happened. Did something already happen to her before they got there? Are you saying this was all done so perfectly in CD gym timing and 1 hour phone call by just a suggestion or a hint? And did anyone ever figure out who the 4th phone number belonged too?

M said...

Alonzo Bull was found to have violated probation back in September 2015. I wonder if that means he'll have to go back to jail or they will just extend probation.

Nanaof4 said...

Lynda said/transcribed:
"And my mind goes to that progression and then it gets to the part about coming home and then I realize I don’t have a home. LONG PAUSE…cuz Amanda was my home, PAUSE And it hurts. Sometimes I feel like that …..pause….that’s somebody’s got my, my head , an, an, an, an, they’re just pushing it under water (small stutter on “w”) over an over an over. And I have no breath inside me an it just hurts so deeply I have no, I can’t breathe underwater and yet, and yet, for just a little season, maybe a couple days, maybe a couple hours, I get this breath, li..I feel this hope…that maybe I’m gonna survive this , only enough to catch my breath an go right back down. If you’ve experienced hurt, you know what I’m talking about. I didn’t know that kind of hurt…till now. Times I feel alone. Times I feel afraid. I don’t even know what I’m afraid about. Times I feel jumpy. There are times I begin to feel hopeful. And then I feel guilty for feeling hopeful. It’s impossible, it’s an impossible burden to carry."

Much of what he is describing is what I and other people in my grief support group express about the loss of our children. However, I find it interesting that he uses holding his head under water in relation to not being able to breathe. We simply say we can't breathe. It feels like something is crushing our chest. I've never heard it explained by someone holding their head under water. I do know that my ex's father would hold his children's heads under water to make them stop crying after beating them. Maybe this is what some of his hiding/strange behavior is about. Child abuse. It may also explain his detachment issues to Amanda's death. This is all my opinion based on my experiences and observations.

Bingo3 said...

Ok I need to take a break from this case! Ha! BUT I do find it interesting that Davey NEVER shares all the beautiful things that Amber's sister posts about her! However, today, he actually does shares A picture and post written about Amanda. It appears it is him in the middle of the group on the floor praying.(which is why it was probably posted, ha!) Today Amber posted a video of she and Amanda the day before she died! It seems like he would be commenting on how special it is to see that video! You would think he would be sharing that video and the beautiful tribute to Amanda. All of his posts are getting through trials, God will work it all for good, Nothing is Wasted, turn mourning into dancing. All about Davey and his getting through this and moving on! Amber truly loved Amanda and writes the most beautiful things honoring her sister, talking about how much fun they had, the memories the made, how can she live without Amanda. Such a contrast!

Hey Jude said...

Bingo, afore you break, or when you return - 'Strings' was the title of the series of talks leading up to Amanda's murder. An 'unprecedented string of crimes' committed by Taylor - break-ins, a rape, robbery and murder in the week leading up to Amanda's murder. How do we know Larry Taylor was not primed to commit his 'unprecedented' string of crimes in order to make Amanda's murder look like part of a random crime spree? Or, that as an increasingly troublesome and unpredictable snitch, he was not chosen by a higher up to murder Amanda, even if, in the event, she had already been killed by Davey?

I don't know how it might have been orchestrated, only that Davey might have dropped hints in the necessary direction and heard by way of return that his problem would be dealt with on such and such a date while he was at the gym, after which Davey became excited, Amanda became deeply worried, he wrote his prophetic sermon, took her to LA with a Levi Lusko 'Through the eyes of a Lion' video (aka 'how the death of a loved one can grow your church') video as a romantic recreation, returned home, preached his horrific sermon, and two days later left the door unlocked when he left his house for the gym.

I continue to suspect Davey because it appeared a very personal attack and murder. There are too many coincidences, even including the unprecedented crime spree, for it to have been the result of a random home invasion.

Bobcat said...

Hey Jude:
"I continue to suspect Davey because it appeared a very personal attack and murder. There are too many coincidences, even including the unprecedented crime spree, for it to have been the result of a random home invasion."

--------

Me too. Your explanation fits exceptionally well!

Hey Jude said...

Bobcat - I think they were told they were going to burgle, but were set up to discover Amanda's body.

If I'm wrong, I will repent, or something. :-)

Hey Jude said...

Taylor may have been told he was going to murder, but still got set up for it. I think Davey did it, just to be sure, and because he wanted to.

(That could be very wrong, of course - it feels wrong to write it, even if it is right. If Davey acted anything like someone whose pregnant wife had been so horribly murdered, it might be possible to think more charitably of him.)

I wish there was a new Blackburn thread upon which to post my newest musings before someone else thinks of it. Lol. :)

---

For anyone's interest, I will post the William Tyrrell 60 Minutes transcript which I've been working on sometime later today - just need to check it through again, but I want a break first. Not much of interest, it's quite disappointing considering how much time there was for the interviewer to talk to the parents, but as I said I would do it. Lol.

Bingo3 said...

Ok so I just can't take the break! Part of my increased interest is what I perceive to be decreased interest! Not much being said lately about the case but it is my prayer that LE is still looking for clues and keeping their eyes on CD! I agree with the above posts that it seems more of a crime of passion and I think he did do something to her BUT these guys were involved! They have the receipts in their car, they are pictured trying to take money out. They left LT at the house. So someone knows something and this was orchestrated very carefully to the time schedule. There was a plan somewhere along the line. They drove a long way to arrive at Sunnydale(?) Why would someone do this for CD without some kind of exchange of money or was the tip and payment the empty house? AND about the scratch on CD face, will be curious if they have gotten DNA evidence from her nails? They are obviously still analyzing this from the crazy, "my wife had an accident" 911 call! Where is the dog? and they had to be suspect to his happy "let's print some t-shirts now" demeanor! I have watched too many 48 hours to think LE isn't a little suspicious! Justice for Amanda please!

Hey Jude, I will watch more of The Strings but I have a really hard time watching him. He makes my skin crawl and I just can't believe people sit in their seats and listen to this guy by choice. Those hands flying everywhere and those awkward pauses where he thinks he has said something so great and he wants his audience to react. If my pastor talked about capping heads, throwing his wife up on the counter, putting a bullet in someone's head and getting rid of worry with a gun (while actually pointing a gun to someone's back!!!), I WOULD RUN SO FAR AWAY from that church and beg all to follow! WOW just WOW

Kate said...

http://www.transylvaniatimes.com/story/2016/01/07/news/church-family-helps-pastor-grieve-brevard-nc/25788.html

Davey and family find a way to cope.......

Hey Jude said...

Bingo - I reckon that's why Resonate is not growing - people do take a look and run after not very long, so his numbers stay low. I should imagine he has a high turnover rate, because people soon begin to feel that something is not right - he oozes aggression and his style is so confrontational. If someone wanted to hear a kind or encouraging word, they'd be hard pressed to get one from Davey.

mom2many said...

Hey Jude,
I'll be interested to see your transcript. Where do you think you'll post it? I don't remember which post we were discussing the William Tyrell case.

Unknown said...

Hi Mom2many, we discussed the William Tyrrell case on the Top 10 2015 blog.

Bottle Cap said...

Kate-OMG that picture on the link you posted. Davey shoving his mom out of the way to pose his bicep. Right in the center of the picture, Davey's ARM.

Bottle Cap said...

Also, more "water" and "we" from Davey, "We never know when the emotions are going to hit," Dave said. "They come in waves."

Hey Jude said...

Mom2many - thanks - I posted it a little while ago - it is here:

http://statement-analysis.blogspot.co.uk/2016/01/top-five-analyzed-news-stories.html

It's quite interesting In places, after all. Lol - I think I was just tired earlier, had my caffeine top-up now.
:)

Hey Jude said...

The parents don't say as much as I had hoped - hardly anything about the Tara doll, mostly it was the DI, who was interested in following up on every disposed of Spider-Man suit.

Bingo3 said...

Bottle Cap, I'd be interested to see the pic of Davey pushing his mom out of the way. HA! Have you seen the post he re-posted yesterday where it appears he is in the middle of a group praying on the floor. I have not once seen him re-post one of an Amanda's tribute except this one. Gag me. Scripture after scripture posted. Take a minute and mourn dude! Or has the mourning ended and dancing started? I can't seem to decide which day he is dancing or which day he has to wait to mourn and then proceed to the dancing. SMH You would think he would be talking about Amanda and paying tribute to her but he is too busy being surrounded by clouds of witnesses and waiting on that best to come because certainly violent murders can not be wasted!

And Hey Jude, yes I think that is most likely the case in that he can't build over 100 because there is no way anyone could stand to listen to him for very long. EEK

Anonymous said...

Link to writeup with picture of Davey's arm -

http://www.transylvaniatimes.com/story/2016/01/07/news/church-family-helps-pastor-grieve-brevard-nc/25788.html

Hey Jude said...

Where's ABB - is she still at the plumbing suppliers?

Hey Jude said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bingo3 said...

CJ. please tell me that he did not tweet that!! That is as insensitive as the posting of the gun video AFTER his wife died from gunshot wounds.

I can't get it to copy and paste for some reason but Amanda's sister, Amber Byars Wilkinson posted the sweetest tribute to Amber. She wrote about what their day looked like the day before Amanda died. A girl at the location where they were playing actually sent her a link to the video footage of her,Amanda and the kids. How special for her sister to have this last piece of Amanda. I found it interesting that she said when she went back to the place (I think a indoor playground) Weston was actually there. She did not say who he was with at all. Strange!

Bingo3 said...

And thanks Anon for the post of the arm! I had never noticed that but you are right! This is narcissism at its very finest! Flexed right up for the camera! LOL

Anonymous said...

Davey Blackburn tweet ~3 hours ago -

"Pain forges the key that unlocks your destiny". . .


And yes Bingo3, I wonder with whom Weston was cruising at the playspace - Amber didn't mention Davey or anyone else. I wonder if it was Meg?

And, Amber clearly didn't need to "figure out how to grieve. . uh. . .the loss. . . . " . . . as Davey said in one of his interviews a few days after Amanda was murdered.

Amber's thoughts and writings about Amanda are pure and sincere and beautiful and from the depths of her heart - impossible to fake, in my opinion. And Davey tweets Bible verses and sayings - and that Amanda wasn't well traveled or well read etc - no love, no sense of loss except for how it affects him and Resonate. And even if he starts writing about her now after two months, it's too late - it would be false and because he felt like he "should".

flightfulbird

Bad Juju said...

A number of people here were critical of Amber early-on for not grieving as they saw fit and talking too much about Davey, etc.

Her recent post about Amanda was lovely, but it didn't come soon enough for some folks, apparently.

Pak31 said...

I know these are two different cases and I don't know exactly what info police have on each husband BUT I find this interesting. I read an article today that detailed the probable cause document in the Dr. Theresa Sievers case. He hasn't been charged in her murder(yet) but he had his friend and an accomplice go to their house so that when she arrived they would attack and kill her. Police believe the husband wanted to cash in her life insurance policy because he was in debt. The home was in Florida. She came home early from vacation and hubby was still in one of the Carolinas I believe. Police in DBs case say early on that he's 100% cleared because they have proof he was at the gym when Amanda was killed. That's really all they've said. Now Sievers husband was in another state and they have proof of that but he was still involved indirectly of her killing. Again two different cases but very similar. We've seen that suspects in DBs case are eerily connected to him. Yet he's deemed not involved after just a couple of days. How could police be so certain he wasn't involved so soon afterward? In Sievers case they say her husband threw out her computers etc right after her funeral and that was strange. DB has said and done many strange things too. The key is tying these guys in Amanda's killing to DB. Maybe they've proven there is no connection. I'm still bugged by it though.

Anonymous said...

Pak31, I've been following the Dr Teresa Sievers case since the day after it happened. Documents have been released (available to read on Websleuths site) and many more are to be released, the investigation is ongoing but the evidence is overwhelming that her husband Mark Sievers was aware that it was going to happen, planned it, whatever....yet he has not yet been arrested or charged - he is freely roaming about Bonita Springs, FL and the surrounding areas.

This gives me hope that the same thing is happening behind the scenes with Davey Blackburn. I strongly feel that there is no way he could be cleared of having any connection whatsoever to Amanda's murder in just a couple of days. Indeed, many on this forum believe that Indy Metro Police put out a statement through a news source that he was "100%" (somewhere I read even 150% !) not involved so he would go on to do his interviews and speak in his "church" and continue to tweet and write on facebook - and all the while they are looking for connections and analyzing his statements and sorting out his involvement and waiting for him to slip up,

Some have said that he wasn't cleared of all involvement, only of being the actual shooter - but I don't even believe they can reliably say he is not the shooter just based on seeing him on tape in the gym during a certain timeframe - because neighbors did not call 911 so there's no real way to know exactly what time they heard gunshots. Some theorize and it's definiely possible that he could've shot her before leaving for the gym - the neighbors supposedly heard only two shots but there were three shots - it goes on and on and on.

Things are not right with this case - there is a connection somehow between him and the guys whose phones pinged at the house. This was a hit - she was shot in the back of the head. There were way, way too many coincidences that morning for this just to have been a random house burglary gone wrong. The interviews he gave afterward are something to watch for sure. The fake mustering up of tears, twisting his wedding ring, always steering the conversation away from the actual questions, never saying he had nothing to do with it.

Interesting to compare the "coincidences" in this case to the Sievers case - especially the behavior of the husbands in the timeframe surrounding the murders. Here's hoping justice will be done for both Amanda and Dr Teresa.

flightfulbird




Anonymous said...

And, I keep clinging to the fact that there were experienced detectives - they should've been able to put the puzzle together and know that Davey was involved and knew this was going to happen - almost as soon as they walked in the door.

Just the things he said and didn't say to the 911 operator should've raised a red flag because clearly he didn't describe it to the operator as a crime scene or that someone had been in the house who shouldn't have been - otherwise they would've rolled IMPD for sure, not just EMTs / medical support.

This whole post is stuff I've said before and others have said before but the forum has been so quiet lately - we're all still hoping something is happening that we can't see, right?

flightfulbird

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