Thursday, August 2, 2018

Past Tense: Mollie Tibbetts and Missing Persons



Missing Persons:  Statement Analysis 

A general principle of Statement Analysis:

The past tense reference to a missing person should be flagged.  This must be understood in context of both human nature and the case. 

Case Context:

a. the age of the victim
b. the length of time missing when the statement is made 
c. News reports either from police, media, or eye witnesses 

Human Nature

Denial is a natural self protective element of the human brain. We all have it. 

a.  The gender 
b.  The relationship 
c.   The quality of the relationship 



The father and boyfriend have spoken out freely. 

These two contextual points are critical in our expectation. 

These are general principles to follow. Generalizations have exceptions; but we do not establish principle on exception. 

As a criminal analyst follows the likeliness found in pattern, investigatory success is realized. Live cases put our work to the test. 

1.  Women have superior emotional capacities over men.  This is neuroscience 101and has only recently, in history, become an issue. The hormonal flooding of a pre-born child at 7-8 weeks creates the difference.  What appears simlilar or indistinguishable at 7 weeks is different at 8 weeks. Oxytocin, for example, is greatly increased upon the child. Every influence upon the child, such as the mother's voice, is now interpreted by the brain through the hormones.  As the male receives higher levels of testosterone, the difference is stark.  

The result is a difference in brain processing, behavior and evidenced in language. This is why it is essential to have male and female analysts. The perspective is complementary. 

2.  Men have stronger physical capacities than women. Testosterone levels are higher and require greater social construct for societal safety and wellbeing.  This is why boys were once taught "sportsmanship" so that they learned to honor weakness after exploiting it in competition. It is why fatherless homes, statistically have more violence, poverty, incarceration and substance abuse.  

Males engage and accept violence more readily than females. They read more about it and are more interested in it. They often can "accept" it in a missing persons case before a female. 

The indoctrination of "social construct" trendy today is another war on nature.  Nature does not lose the war, though bloody battles, such as societal acceptance of female violence, ensue.  This narrative leaves young people woefully unprepared for the hardship of life and the challenge of child rearing. It was championed by politicians which should have been society's first red flag. 

Folly 

I ask analysts to consider a loved one receiving an anonymous threatening letter but refusing to identify the author because it would mean discerning if language is male or female. "I know who wrote it and who you can arrest, but if I tell you, I am sexist and racist."  Its a great thing for the ivory tower, but not for law enforcement or for safety. 

This basic observation is why this indoctrination has significantly less impact upon men and women in law enforcement.  Little instruction on human nature is needed. 

3.  Men will accept death earlier than Women.  The denial (resistance) is more powerful upon women.  

4.  Fathers will begin to entertain the possibility of death of the victim before mothers will. 

5.  Siblings will begin to entertain the possibility of death before fathers. 

6.  Relationship Quality (objective) will factor into this. A biological mother will normally have higher denial levels than step mothers. Aunts, uncles, etc, all may show earlier acceptance or entertainment of possibility.  This can change contextually in: 

7. Relationship Quality (subjective) may indicate a very close bond (as seen in the language) of step mother having more resistance than a bio-mother not involved in the child's life. Even a non-relative who has been in the role of caretaker may show greater reluctance to use the past tense verb. 

The External Context:

a.  the age of the victim: A child incapable of self protection will factor into the language acutely. 
b.  the behavior of the victim: A runaway or substance abuse addict, with behavioral issues of risk, will impact acceptance.  
c. News reports of any manner, such as police confiding in the family, media reports, neighbors, friends, crime rates, etc. 

The biological parents of a missing toddler who reference their child in the past tense very early in the disappearance indicate a belief or knowledge of the child's death.  The belief to knowledge factor in the language may be conflicted; from a nagging doubt to guilty knowledge. 

The natural denial of a mother is expected.  Even when placing a deceased child in a mother's arms, she may attempt to warm the child.  

Here are some quotes from Mollie Tibbets' case. They are disjointed. 




The boyfriend of missing college student Mollie Tibbetts told Fox News in an exclusive interview on Wednesday that he believes the doors of the home where she last stayed had been left unlocked – and he now locks his doors consistently.


[ STATEMENT ]: 

“It’s Brooklyn. You don’t lock your doors,” said the boyfriend, Dalton Jack. We lock our doors now. Every night.”

The use of the pronoun "you" indicates universality.  It is a common practice in some communities, still. 


[ STATEMENT ]:

“It’s more than likely because you know, nobody ever thought there was a reason to. Again, it’s Brooklyn. Nothing ever happens in Brooklyn. That’s why it’s such a blindsided situation.”

Repetition increases importance. The boyfriend, according to Media, is not a suspect.  Here he revisits this point and has a need to explain why. We need to ask why this is important to him.

He was 100 miles away on a construction job, apparently verified by law enforcement. 

What has produced this sensitivity?

Without a good interview or strong quote, we do not know. 

*guilt over not protecting her?
*guilt over not reminding her to lock up at night, or leaving her alone?
*guilt due to knowledge not shared?

We do not know. 

Calling it a "situation" is to be noted. Does he believe she was kidnapped? If so, it is not a "situation."  This would be minimization. 

Does he believe or know that something was bothering her?

This would be a "situation" and he should openly state anything he knows. 

"Blindsided" is another word to consider. I would like to know more about his personal dictionary. 

When asked about texting or calling her: 

"I did for like the first week and a half. Not more recently. I was just trying to see literally if anybody would pick up. And then, yeah, straight to voicemail," he said.

He is young ("like", "literally") but I note the passivity of "And then, yeah, straight to voicemail." 


Mark raised excellent questions here. 

Was he seeing if Mollie would pick up? Any expectation that she would pick up?  In the statement, this thought that Mollie might pick up is missing.

Here is another statement in which we recognize that there is missing information.  

Is it innocuous missing information, or is it critical?

Is is something he told police, but was instructed not to reveal it publicly?

"left for Dubuque, Iowa, which is about 100 miles away, on Tuesday morning at 5 in the morning. And I was staying there for work until what was supposed to be Friday. And then Thursday after we found out she was  missing I drove home. So I was in Dubuque the entire time.

Please note that  "left" is an unnecessary connection here. His focus is upon the time and location of where he departed from; not upon where he was going. 

He alibis himself.  Why?

In a close relationship, I do not expect him to say "we" found out.  Perhaps he was with a work crew when the information came; rather than being alone.  I do not know, but I want to know. 

Is this due to guilt?  Or is it due to the sense of suspicion around him?  
Was it due to a news that he heard while with others?

I do not know from the limited statements. 

He is withholding information. It could be:

*he was late, rushing for work with a 2 hour drive; this would be innocuous and occurs approximately 70% of the time it is used. This is common in work situations. 

What I want to know is this:

What happened and what was said prior to his departure. 

Keep in mind, he may have already told police and he may have been instructed to keep this quiet. 

*Was she depressed?
*With whom did they associate?
*Did they argue?
*Was she on Rx?
*Was she asleep?

**Did he believe she might have a reason to leave on her own?

My interview would focus right here in order to clear him or obtain information relevant to what happened. Right before he left, my focus would begin. 

In the live broadcast, I heard him repeat "left" in his statement. Again, it could be innocuous but it must always be followed up upon.  

 He "left" and he had the need to explain why he left. 


“for work” - Why he was staying in Dubuque was important enough to include here. Why is this so important to him to include right here? Has he felt suspicion upon him?

Does he feel guilt over reliving the last moments? Regret? Is he struggling with "what if I had..."?

Or is he concealing critical information?

If so, was it already shared with investigators? 

Investigators frequently and appropriately restrict speech, by request, to protect the integrity of the investigation. 



[ STATEMENT ]:

"I mean everybody has their own theories but I’m just kind of leaving it up to the law enforcement trying to figure that one out. I don’t want to go racking it through my brain thinking of what happened, what happened, what happened. Just driving myself insane.”

Concern for self noted. It could drive any loving person "insane" but concern for the victim means processing every thought for a possible clue. 


Mollie Tibbet's brother:

Jake Tibbetts, 21: older brother's statements.  His age, gender and his relationship must all be considered in context. 

“She had the biggest heart. If anyone needed it, she was willing to doing anything. She hated to be sad and hated (for) others to be sad.”

This indicates belief or knowledge that she is deceased.  The belief could be doubt, but it is strong enough to be in the language  and repeated. 

Guilty knowledge often attempts to conceal past tense reference, and may "slip" out inadvertently. Here, he is plainly speaking.  

*Does he know or does he believe (including entertaining doubts) that Mollie is deceased?


He now goes into memory to consider his interaction with her. This should be past tense verbs: 

“If Scott or I needed it, she’d send us a text. If we were having a tough time, she’d text us, ‘I love you guys'. Scott and I aren’t the kind of people to think that way. In hindsight, I really appreciated that she was.”

Here he works from memory and relates ongoing (indefinite) events and compares his personality to hers. 

"In hindsight, I really appreciate that she was" is a strong past tense reference. 

The qualification of "really" is typical of siblings' language, which is unique, often competitive and reluctant to credit. They grow out of this (usually). 

With these statements, it is likely the brother believes she is dead. 

Siblings have rivalry and often speak in a manner in which they understand each others' language well. 


“She wasn’t afraid to be herself. A one of a kind.”

It is not subtle denigration, but the unique way siblings, at a young age, often compliment each other. 

Sibling competition enters his language and the compliment is typical of the sibling context and the compliment which shows concession. 


“She ran in cross country and track and still ran five times a week. She didn’t have the most talent, but she tried the hardest. Her talent was in speech and plays.”

Male siblings often have more struggle issuing compliments than female.  



They haven’t found anything, so as far as I know, she is alive,” Jake said.

His hope is weak. 

Analysis Conclusion:  Inconclusive. 

1. Father 

The father's focus has been, in the limited statements, upon his child; appropriately. Dad is showing signs of strain and is desperate for information.  His priority is his daughter.  Dad does not care for anything but his daughter.  His linguistic focus is the opposite of those referenced, including the McCanns, Baby Lisa's parents, Baby Sabrina's parents, Jonbenet Ramsey's parents, Justin DiPietro, father of Baby Ayla, Hailey Dunn's mother, Billie Jean Dunn and others indicated for deception. These cases are all covered on the blog. 

2.  Brother 

The brother indicates belief that his sister is dead.  He indicates inner conflict with this, but his doubt outweighs his optimism. He does not, in this limited sample, indicate guilty knowledge. 

3.  Boyfriend

The boyfriend is concealing information. He may have been appropriately instructed to do so.  It is not known to this point. Restrictions similar to this is found routinely in medial professionals limited in what they are permitted to talk about. 

This does not mean he is involved.  It means that he is thinking of something that he is not saying. The traffic or rushing that morning may be on his mind. 

Or, it could be more significant.  

*Did they argue?
*Did she run away?
*Was he instructed to not talk about her mental state at the time of her disappearance?


He could have shared this with police, or he may have felt accused by them, but it is not known from these short statements if it is guilty knowledge. 

The analyst must not jump to conclusion but be led by the subject. Police have reportedly cleared him as a suspect. 

Attendant Guilt

In many cases of investigation, we find "attendant guilt."  Investigators, for example, seeking to learn an answer often come upon illicit, immoral or illegal behavior, though unrelated to the original investigatory question. 

In theft by employee, the investigation may indicate guilt, only to learn that he did not steal the money, but he has been doing other things, such as not showing up or showing up late, and having others cover for him.  He may not have stolen, but he indicates guilt in his language because he has been using drugs on the job... and on it goes. 

Years ago, a father was deceptive about his missing child. Later, a child molester neighbor was arrested and convicted of her murder. Why did the father indicate deception?  

He was under the influence when his toddler left the home.  As he spoke, he attempted to conceal this critical information. 

Statement Analysis begins with the presupposition of de facto innocence which allows for high level content analysis. If the subject "talks us out" of this presupposition, we indicate guilt with "Deception Indicated."

For an example of presupposition of truth leading to linguistic confrontation, see the analysis of the parents of Madeleine McCann here.  Listen to their words and let their words guide you. This is an example of explaining principles employed to an untrained audience. 




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These are cases in which the greatest growth takes place: they are not academic but live cases in which the results have consequence. This includes detecting deception, content analysis and profiling. This allows for identifying anonymous authors, as well as strategy for the investigation and interview. 

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139 comments:

Anonymous said...

This reminds me of the Tammy Zywicki case from 1992.

JoAnn said...

The noon press conference was interesting. The Tibbett family spoke, as did a Crimestoppers representative.
Mollie’s mom says she believes Mollie is still alive, but her words say something different.
Mollie’s mom: “Every day I feel Mollie’s presence with me. Um, you know, sometimes I just feel her sitting on my shoulder, and Mollie was an incredibly strong young woman...”

JoAnn said...

Also at the noon press conference, Dalton Jack (boyfriend of Mollie) was asked by a reporter “What would you like to say to the individual who has abducted Mollie?”

Dalton: “You know, if they’re listening, then I would just like them to know that, imagine this was you. Everybody has a Mollie in their life, a person who has affected her, um, them, in a way that she affected everybody standing up here right now. And imagine if this was you, and somebody had taken your Mollie. Um, wouldn’t you want to help? Wouldn’t you want her back? How would you feel? Just do the right thing and let her go, pretty much.”

Peter said he would like to know more about Dalton Jack’s usual language style & that would be helpful. Perhaps he has a very passive personality as well. His words are pretty passive. There’s not much there to persuade an abductor to free his hostage. “ JUST do the right thing, PRETTY MUCH.”
When the boyfriend stepped forward and began speaking, the brother (Jake) who was standing behind him, dropped (bowed) his head (the part where he said “if they’re listening...)

So many things in the boyfriend’s language are troubling. “racking it in my brain, what happened, what happened, what happened...”
“...I was there the entire time”

Mollie’s father said something interesting at the beginning about why LE isn’t sharing info with the family. I’ll have to find the exact words, but it was something like the information couldn’t be shared with them in case it implicated someone (in the family? someone they knew?). I’ll try to find the exact quote.

Lucia D said...

Thank you Peter, for the analysis of mothers vs. fathers, and siblings vs. parents. Very interesting, and makes sense. At first I think a number of us were alarmed at the brother's speaking of Mollie only in the past tense. But your explanation of why a sibling might do so before a parent are insightful. Also the difference of him being a brother (male) rather than a female sibling makes a lot of common sense. I think of my brother vs. my sisters, when we were that age, and yup, he would have been very awkward if it came to complimenting one of us!

JoAnn said...

Mollie’s father’s statement at the press conference, praising law enforcement:

“They’ve put together an incredible investigation. It’s large; it’s sophisticated, aggressive. And they’ve been nothing but sensitive to our family, and to suggest otherwise is wrong. But they are not sharing information with us because they don’t need to share information with someone who might be implicated in this.”

Anonymous said...

"But they are not sharing information with us because they don’t need to share information with someone who might be implicated in this.”

So someone in the family is a Person of Interest?

I'm also curious as the where the dog was...still in the house when Mollie disappeared?

Anonymous said...

Praising law enforcement....so did DeOrr Kunz's father when his son went missing in Idaho.

Anonymous said...

Ok I just spent a long time trying to find the first two interviews that they did with the boyfriend Dalton Jack. If anyone has a link to the entire version vs. the now truncated versions used in follow up media stories, please post so I can get the exact wording. One interview is in the cab of his truck. The things that hit me were: (paraphrasing from memory)
He does speak in present tense.
He says after he heard from her mom that they checked the hospital and she wasn't there that he "started raising the red flags". This struck me because they now were saying that she might have on a red shirt that she would be wearing the next day for a day camp or day care trip. Is there any significance to red? (in his speech that is).

Anonymous said...

The brother also praises the community, social media, friends and family, the outpouring etc.
Everyone is different and all that but it always gets me a bit when there is a lot of smiling when talking about these things and trying to make light of the matter. The boyfriend is now smiling a lot in interviews, maybe getting more comfortable with a role he never knew he would play. I don't know. I couldn't.

Anonymous said...

Another thing from the original boyfriend interview is he says "I will never stop looking for you/her" (again paraphrasing). Deorr Kunz senior also said, I will never stop looking for you son, we are coming to get you . . .

JoAnn said...

@Anonymous 4:32 pm
When I first heard the father’s comment about LE not sharing info because someone might be implicated, I also wondered if he meant a family member or friend/boyfriend was perhaps involved. But after watching it a couple more times, I think he was speaking in a more general sense. Meaning that LE, in general, keep info to themselves, rather than sharing with family who might also inadvertently share with others critical information that could become known by someone who becomes a suspect. Meaning this could happen in any case, and could happen in this case as well, since they don’t know yet what happened to Mollie.

Kimberly Smith said...

"Dalton: “You know, if they’re listening, then I would just like them to know that, imagine this was you. Everybody has a Mollie in their life, a person who has affected her, um, them, in a way that she affected everybody standing up here right now. And imagine if this was you, and somebody had taken your Mollie. Um, wouldn’t you want to help? Wouldn’t you want her back? How would you feel? Just do the right thing and let her go, pretty much.”

FOURTEEN delaying intro words before his point: '...imagine this was you." Which he says TWICE. Strong identification with the perp, imho.

Second sentence, "Everybody...now." Could he be more vague? Are there no ways he can actually praise her specifically?

'If you (the perp) were me (the boyfriend)'.... Interchangeable.

More interchangeables: 'you would not want to help' 'you would not want her back'
'you would feel how' (he doesn't know what to feel)

"Just do the right thing..." Very dry and unemotional. There is no personal connection to Mollie whatsoever in this statement, imo.

But my SA skills are near zero. Be kind, lol.

Mike Dammann said...

We are taught that in missing persons cases it is important for close ones to take a polygraph in order to rule out suspicion to help police focus attention on finding the right person(s). When someone wants to establish an alibi through words, why can that not be the case that the boyfriend wants to indicate he has an alibi to make sure focus is not wasted on him?
There is a difference between a 911 call and starting off with an alibi and a little bit of time having passed where it would seem reasonable wanting to make sure people continue looking rather than assuming.

lynda said...

Mollie's mom today used the past tense..

"Everyday I feel Mollie's presence with me. Sometimes I just feel her sitting on my shoulder. And Mollie WAS an incredibly strong young woman and I don't know that I have the strength in me and Mollie is lending me her strength every day and every night," she said.

Shannon Pritchard said...

I've read that the dogs were in the basement, which is where they're kept when no one is home.

Anonymous said...

Can we work on the Zodiac puzzle?

I think the Zodiac's father was a cop...I came to this conclusion from linguistic analysis of his letters.

I don't think the zodiac was dyslexic as some have postulated. I think his spellings are intentional and are merely done as a rebellion against order.

Someone in the zodiac's life (probably the father) I believe was in the KKK, hence his costume that he wore when killing (the hood over the head, etc).

Why does he love symbols so much?

Anonymous said...

Here is one of the zodiac's letter:

https://goo.gl/images/omAa75

I wonder if the zodiac was a prison guard.

Look at this letter, and notice the language "punished if they did not comply", etc. Like the language of a prison guard.

Also, the lone survivor of one of the zodiac's attacks said that he spoke to them and said he had "escaped from (a certain) prison in Montana and had killed a prison guard" (however he said that just to calm them initially to lead them to think he just wanted their car).....however, there is the language of someone "strict", "in authority" "who punishes if people don't comply" throughout his letters.

Either that, or he could have been a school teacher?

Even the way he announces "This is the zodiac speaking" in his letters--seems like maybe someone who announces things over a PA system in a school like a teacher or a principal.

anon said...

That is how school principals talk on the PA systems in a school "Hello, this is the principal speaking",

The zodiac begins his letters

"This is the zodiac speaking",

Lucia D said...

I see Dad’s statement as the ingratiation factor. Not necessarily in an lincriminating sense. But more wanting LE to work hard to find his daughter . Not a stupid approach.

John mcgowan said...



"Dalton: “You know, if they’re listening, then I would just like them to know that, imagine this was you. Everybody has a Mollie in their life, a person who has affected her, um, them, in a way that she affected everybody standing up here right now. And imagine if this was you, and somebody had taken your Mollie. Um, wouldn’t you want to help? Wouldn’t you want her back? How would you feel? Just do the right thing and let her go, pretty much.”

I like that he uses her name, he is humanizing her.

At first it reads as if he is distancing himself from her (Everybody has a Mollie, Your Mollie). But he is appealing to whomever has her, (if they’re listening) if someone has. In other words. If this was your girlfriend (name) and someone had taken her, how would you feel. (put yourself in my shoes [empathetic] ). He could have said, everybody has "somebody" (passive) in their life, what if someone had taken your partner, showing a disconnect.

We don't know if he has been coached to use her name, but more than likely has, even so.

Peter Hyatt said...

Consider the father’s praise towards search in context:

This is not searching local fields or waters. It is nation wide.

The victim is not small child.

He is rallying forces.

Peter

Peter Hyatt said...

John, I thought you’re correct — his language suggests over emphasis and it is different now.

Coaching.

Peter Hyatt said...

You’ll note that no conclusion was drawn as to alibi establishment.

Peter Hyatt said...

The spokeswoman for the crime stoppers went fully past tense. This reveals her belief. Context: “tell me who Mollie is” by interviewer.

“Mollie was a....”

This is character; not event.

It’s her belief given what she knows and her experiences in the organization.

Unknown said...

I also JUST read an article where the mother was speaking about the reward and that the abductor could claim the reward. She used some past tense in the article when talking about mollie and how she sends her strength and is sitting on her shoulder and talks about her daughter in past tense with “was”. I think they are giving up slowly subconciously.

Unknown said...

Yes, I read the dogs were in the basement. This all suggested Mollie was getting ready to head to work. Red shirt missing, dogs locked up for the day. She isnt known to wear work attire to run. So this suggests the next day I think someone she knew considering small town offered her a ride to work and she accepted it but never made it to the location. It might have been inpromptu just driving past on their way someplace else.. No struggle. She knew this person and was decieved by this person.

Unknown said...

He is also a kid and its hard when you try not to give any information away like you are instructed not to. So maybe he needs to take a speech class. Doesnt mean he lacks sadness or rationality or make him the perp. It means hes simple and maybe not stellar at public speaking..

Unknown said...

I feel bad for her. I think she is giving up hope subconciously. Bless her

Peter Hyatt said...

Mother's doubts:

"We believe Mollie is alive"


The creeping of doubt is incessant with each passing hour. It tears down resistance and denial.

If media had only done a simple interview with the boyfriend and let us hear him for ourselves, we would know.

Peter

John mcgowan said...

Her Mum has slipped into past tense. This is so sad.

Calderwood said she feels her daughter's presence every day.

"Mollie was an incredibly strong young woman, and I don't know that I have the strength in me, but Mollie is lending me her strength every day, every night," she said.

https://cnn.it/2Ku9puS

JoAnn said...

@John mcgowan
I, too, feel the mother’s sadness and my heart is heavy. And the father is desperately sticking to the business of finding his daughter and staying so strong that I fear for him if they don’t have some answers soon.

Anonymous said...

Dalton: “You know, if they’re listening, then I would just like them to know that, imagine this was you. Everybody has a Mollie in their life, a person who has affected her, um, them, in a way that she affected everybody standing up here right now. And imagine if this was you, and somebody had taken your Mollie. Um, wouldn’t you want to help? Wouldn’t you want her back? How would you feel? Just do the right thing and let her go, pretty much.

Everybody has a Mollie in their life, a person who has affected her, um, them, in a way that she affected everybody standing up here right now.

She affected everybody -- past tense.

Just do the right thing and let her go, pretty much -- too casual.

Pretty much -- what does he mean exactly? Let her go to some degree? Almost let her go but not really?

He knows something

Galaxios

John mcgowan said...

I may have to step back for a while. I think my emotions are to invested and it's clouding my judgement.

John mcgowan said...

"Judgement" is the wrong word, you get picture. I hope Mollie comes home safe and well.

Mike Dammann said...

Peter,

if my girlfriend went missing, I doubt that I would establish an alibi in a 911 call. But knowing I am automatically a suspect, I can imagine approaching the police within a couple of days with accurate information regarding my whereabouts to keep them from wasting men-power and energy investigating me.

I can also imagine referring to such alibi within a public statement to make sure everyone interested in helping will focus their own energies in the right direction.

I know I will probably look like the A-hole within a few weeks when he turns out the prime-suspect.

But this is not 1980 where significant others become offended learning they have also been investigated in a disappearance. This is way-past-OJ-America where people understand what police officers have to do and it can only make their work easier by volunteering information before they have time to get to you.

Mike

Michaela said...

More from the boyfriend.

"Everybody has a Mollie, a person that has changed your life in such a huge way and that’s in everybody’s lives. Just imagine if somebody had taken your Mollie," he told ABC News' Cecelia Vega in an interview Friday on "Good Morning America."

"Put yourself in our shoes. You would do anything to get her back and you would just be desperate for anything to come forward to get her back," he added.

"We were just having conversations on and off through text and Snapchat, and that was about all. It seemed like a totally normal night,"

I'm seeing a LOT of distancing, a few comparitive "just"'s, and should that "seemed like a normal night" indicate it wasn't?

Anonymous said...

to Anonymous at Aug 3 12:50 pm:

https://www.insideedition.com/missing-iowa-jogger-mollie-tibbetts-was-doing-homework-late-night-she-disappeared-45505

Bobcat said...

Mollies' brother Jake

Complimenting Investigators for not finding his sister: "As far as the investigation, we don’t know a lot," Jake told In Touch exclusively, revealing he was one of the last people to see his sister. "We have really good people working on it and we have a lot of faith in them. They’ve been called in for a reason and are really good at what they do."


"She had the biggest heart" makes me wonder what condition her body will be in, if it is ever found.


Peter Hyatt said...

Out of context.

If the victim was a child and a specific area was searched and failure resulted, we would not expect praise.

The search is broad and long.

The subject is not a bio patent; a sibling.


The brother saying she had a big heart equated to the condition of the body is absurd.

Anonymous said...

"Mollie is a very, very responsible individual and she's super nice and compassionate and just someone that people look up to," Hope Beck, her best friend, told HLN. "You strive to be like her. And it's just not likely in any type of way that she would run off. She had career plans. She had a vacation planned. It's just not like her to not talk to her friends or family for awhile."

Hope Beck, another one of Mollie’s close friends from Brooklyn, said Mollie is the kind of person who “knows how to make everyone feel comfortable around her.”

“That’s why so many people looked up to her. She was the kind of person I would go to with personal issues,” Hope told Dateline Wednesday.

Mollie’s friend Hope told Dateline she was one of the of people who showed up to search for Mollie the day after she disappeared.

“It’s something I never thought I would have to do. I was very anxious the whole time and nervous,” Hope said. “It’s just something you don’t even know really how to describe, because you don’t know the emotions you’re feeling.”

Mollie’s friend Hope is also preparing to go back to college herself.

“I just am hoping that Mollie is able to come home, and how I feel will be better by the time I go back [to college],” Hope said. Hope added that, since most of Mollie’s Brooklyn, Iowa friends are home for summer vacation, they’ve tried to help each other get through this unimaginable situation.

“This has definitely brought people closer,” Hope told Dateline. “We try to talk and be with each other as much as we can to support everyone.”

Hope has used the past tense also and I find generally her priorities unusual.

Bobcat said...

OT...?

Are there statement statistics related to language used in which victims turned up dismembered?

Anonymous said...

could the boyfriend "racking his brain" potentially be leakage related to a firearm? The act of chambering a round in a semi-automatic pistol or a shotgun is referred to as racking. With that comment followed by "what happened" repeated 3 times makes me wonder if there was a weapon involved in her disappearance or in their last interaction together. Possibly an unintentional discharge with the boyfriend startled and then fleeing "in the morning at 4 in the morning" The time is very important to him.

JoAnn said...

I don’t think it’s unusual to find friends, etc. referencing Mollie in the past tense, as she has been missing now for more than two weeks, even with FBI and other law enforcement searching and intense media spotlight on her case with no results. As much as people will state they aren’t giving up hope, they are aware that statistics don’t support an optimistic outcome. These young people don’t want to believe their friend isn’t coming back.

Allison Roberts said...

Peter! I am fascinated by your work and thrilled to see you commenting on this case. When I heard Dalton say these words

“I don’t want to go racking it through my brain thinking of what happened”

in his interview, alarm bells went off in my head. Am I reading into it too much? It sounds like he knows what happened and doesn’t want to think about it. Does he know because he was there and can picture exactly what happened in his mind’s eye? Perhaps too little info to go on, but I would love to know your thoughts on that particular phrase
(And everyone must say this, but I find myself self-conscious even commenting on your blog, knowing you can analyze everything I say, but I feel better at least acknowledging that lol)

Allison Roberts said...

I don’t know if you’ve seen these quotes/interviews from Dalton and his Mom, but several statements were “off” to me. Would love to read or hear your analysis: https://heavy.com/news/2018/07/mollie-tibbetts-boyfriend-dalton-jack-facebook/

Anonymous said...

"don't want to go racking my brains figuring out what happened, what happened, what happened" --boyfriend

Mollie will probably be found with head trauma from repeated blunt force injuries with a large rock or something of that nature.

Boyfriend's statement that he "kissed her goodbye" is a red flag.

What condition were Abby and Libby found in? Did they have head trauma?

In my opinion, boyfriend's language betrays possible severe head trauma inflicted on Mollie. My guess is she is above ground and left near to the place of death.

Anonymous said...

There will be injuries in head/neck area. Sharp or blunt object used. Repeated blows.
There may be exposed brain.

Anonymous said...

I just listened to a short interview with the boyfriend, and that is the first time that I heard his voice.

Could someone please listen to this recording of the Delphi killer saying "Go down the hill" and tell me if it sounds similar to his voice/accent, or am I just imagining that?!?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8xq5KgKHyE

Bobcat said...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRUQXmqIvbg

Mollie's younger brother Scott, in interview with older brother Jake. Jake sits with his hands apart at his sides, while Scott holds one wrist with his other hand in a cross body blocking gesture. This is not a continuous statement but edited together.

Interviewer: What grade are you in school, where are you going to college, and all that?

Scott: "Uh. I’m going to be a senior this year. I ... play sports, do, regular guy things. Uh, I think I’m going to go to Iowa. I haven’t decided what I’m going to go into yet. I haven’t made that full decision, but. [big sigh]

I would say it’s, like he [brother Jake] said, a whole lot of negative emotions but a whole lot of them between confusion, sadness and, sometimes even just anger at the whole situation and, you know we’re all disappointed and we just, we really want her home.
She’s incredibly kind and sweet, and I think we would both say that she has, her life planned out better than [duping delight? smile], a lot of people do and, she was, you know, ready to go into the world and she, you know, took everything with passion. She loved her friends and family and, she, she was eager and, you know, that’s why you see all this support, is ‘cause, you know, she really affected a lot of people, and meant a lot to a lot of people.

Been, doing, we, said at the beginning every day, you know, what can we do today, to help and, get closer to, you know, the ultimate goal.
I mean, we’ve said at the beginning every day, pretty much, you know, what can we do today, to get closer to our ultimate goal of finding her and, what can we do, as a family, you know, you know, to be productive today and, not just sit around because that’s doing nothing [unintelligible] get her back home."





Lars Bak said...

"I left for Dubuque, Iowa, which is about 100 miles away, on Tuesday morning at 5 in the morning. And I was staying there for work until…”

I think this not only raises questions about right before his departure but also about the trip itself. He doesn’t say “I went to Dubuque…” but “I left FOR Dubuque…” which suggests an interrupted action; what prevented him from going straight to Dubuque? It is further emphasized by the following “. AND I was staying…”; big TL. He should be asked what happened during the trip.

“I don’t want to go racking it through my brain thinking of what happened, what happened, what happened.”

Could the little “of” here be some sort of leakeage. It puzzles me that he doesn’t express the meaning “I don’t want to go racking it through my brain thinking “what happened, what happened, what happened.”” He appears to be thinking OF what happened; how can he know?

Peter Hyatt said...

We are now seeing the resistance to death weakening which brings the “angelizing” of the victim from loved ones. This was noted in antiquity where a person who dies, no matter the life style, is given strong positive weighted language.

Anonymous said...


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Mollie Tibbetts latest: Frustration builds as police stay mum on missing Iowa woman
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MONTEZUMA, Iowa -- Investigators are offering no new details in their search for a University of Iowa student who vanished more than two weeks ago.

Kevin Winker, investigative operations director for the Iowa Department of Public Safety, said Friday he knows the tight-lipped approach is frustrating for people who are eager to know what happened to 20-year-old Mollie Tibbetts.

But he says investigators will continue to withhold basic details about the case because they believe it gives them the best chance to solve it.


more

http://abc7ny.com/frustration-builds-as-police-stay-mum-on-mollie-tibbetts-case/3882453/

Anonymous said...

Peter, what do you make of these statements made mother of mollie?

The anguished mom of missing student Mollie Tibbetts has revealed perplexing new clues about her daughter's mysterious disappearance two weeks ago - telling DailyMail.com: 'I'm in purgatory.'



But without a single credible lead pointing to her daughter's whereabouts, Laura Calderwood, 54, added: 'I'm either going to be headed up to heaven or down to hell, depending on the result.'

Peter Hyatt said...

The anguish of a mother losing hope.

Peter Hyatt said...

Laura Calderwood called on Snap Inc. to do everything possible to find her daughter's final message and establish when it was sent.

'In my opinion virtually everything electronic can be retrieved,' she told us. 'It's not like they throw the Snapchats into the water and they float down the stream.'

This far, no red flags in parents’ statements.

Mother here is identifying specific fears that she likely attempts to resist. She is tormented. Concern for possible suicide (language of eternity) should cause someone close to mom to support her or get a professional involved with her.

Mollie not living w her could increase guilt, pain remorse and lack of control —— control over risk is crucial to parents.

Peter Hyatt said...

(Mom likely fearful someone dumped her daughter in water) — leakage confirming the pain she is experiencing.

Thus far, neither parent has had red flags in their language.

Media did poor job reporting on farmer.

BF likely advises to withhold info.

JoAnn said...

Peter, I agree that the media has done a poor job reporting on the pig farmer. I was surprised that none of the major news outlets gave any info about his criminal past. Or is that because he isn’t named suspect? There are reports detailing a lengthy criminal record, more than just two previous stalking cases, but all seemingly related to or similar to those; although none on any major news outlets or even local Iowa news, but on one of those “news & info” websites. The interviews with this farmer were just downright odd.

Eugenia said...

so you can post under different names talking to yourself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

True story

JoAnn said...

It’s painful to watch the deterioration of Mollie’s parents as the days pass without news. Listening to interviews and statements of Mollie’s boyfriend, I think what I’m hearing more than anything else is bewilderment. Nothing in this young man’s life has prepared him for this tragic thrust into the spotlight.
Can SA still be applied if a person has been briefed, or coached, by law enforcement before a press conference or interview? SA is still applied when a person has been “coached” by their attorney, before an interview, for example, right? I don’t think there’s anything particular to look at with this family, but am just wondering what consideration is given to that aspect?

Bobcat said...

https://whotv.com/2018/08/01/iowan-with-multiple-stalking-charges-admits-to-police-questioning-in-search-for-mollie-tibbetts/

Interview with Wayne Cheney transcribed:
Q: Wayne, what has it been like these last, you know few weeks? Take me through what the community has been going through, what you’ve been seeing, the activity.
A: [arms crossed on chest] I haven’t really seen much so I really don’t know what’s going on. I have no idea what they’re doing. It’s just a bad deal. [wipes nose and eye]

Q: What’s been the, I guess the hardest part?
A: It’s that they can’t find her heh [smile]

Q: How does that, that’s been impacting you even though you don’t even know, you know, the person, right?
A: Nope, I don’t know her.

Q: What’s that like not knowing someone being frustrated about their situation?
A: Haha. I don’t know. It’s just a bad deal.

Q: Um, you had said, you know, I mean, we heard different people, I mean all- People in Brooklyn, people out here, uh, at hog farms that own, you know, different properties, police come in and and going through things. What was the situation like uh for you here, and how they kind of approached everything?
A: Oh, I don’t know. Huh huh, [scratches cheek] I don’t know. We’re wasting our time. I’m done. [turns to leave]

Q: You said the FBI, uh, took you down to the fire station, right? [crosstalk]
A: No, it wasn’t the FBI. I don’t know who them two guys were, they took me to the fire station, Tuesday. [Wipes eye]

Q: And they asked questions.
A: [continues wiping eye] Questioned me a couple, for a couple hours they questioned me [wiping eye]

Q: Just about what, what, maybe you were asked like what you saw here or actually where you been or, I mean
A: Yeah [touches nose]

Q: What was that, wh, what kind of questions?
A: [wiping eye] Nah, I don’t even remember what they asked me. [wiping eye] It was, it was a waste of my time, I know that.

Q: Yeah. Did you feel like, you know, it can’t be an easy situation, right? The police, you know they say they’re doing their job and questioning but, does it unfortunately make, I mean, uh, like you feel like they’re, second guessing you as a, uh, a resident here?
A: Yeah, yeah.

Q: And were there questions that made you feel like, hey, wait, wait a second, am I the one being questioned?
A: Yep

Q: And why is that?
A: No, I, I don’t know. It, it was just a waste of time, I thought. Oh well. [arms crossed on chest]

Q: And that was on Tuesday, they took you into Brooklyn I guess?
A: Yep.

Q: Huh. Um. And so, uh, how do you feel like they should have been, you know, spending their time?
A: [Shrugs, arms crossed on chest] No, I don’t know. Haha. I really don’t know.

Q: Um, have you seen activity at the, the hog farms across the road?
A: Nope.

Q: And what about, uh, you know, when, when you made a comment. What did, you told the FBI to, to get away or the, the people that came and took you down to the station, just to, go away or something and they said they had some kind of snide comment?
A. [rubs eye] Neh. I don’t know. I’m done. I’m done.

Mike Dammann said...

10 time "don't know"

Barbara said...

I can’t help but wonder if boyfriend called so many times to cover for a series of calls before she died? I still think it’s him. Maybe they were fighting via text or calls.

lynda said...

The reporting has been abominable during this. Local Sheriff/BCI waited6 days to call in FBI. FBI was the one that executed subpoena for FitBit, phone, emails, etc. 6 days! I also think that this archaic system of not telling anyone anything (holdover from J.Edgar Hoover days) is damaging and ridiculous. Their greatest resource is the Public.

Ladies! (Mothers, tell your daughters) to have at least one person that knows ALL your logins and passwords to your electronics. Phone, emails, fitbit, etc. The difference between accessing these items IMMEDIATELY upon knowing someone is missing, and having to wait for subpoenas (days) could literally mean the difference between life and death for the abducted.

Bobcat said...

Mollie's family is related to Sheriff Kreigel. This is a very small community and the "cousins" go back for generations.

JoAnn said...

Multiple reports of a body found in Lee County, Iowa (a couple of hours away from Brooklyn). The deceased is a young white woman in early to mid-20’s. Investigators refuse to comment on this death & say they have no reason to believe the decedent is Mollie Tibbetts. Authorities say they will not release the location of the body at this time and have requested the assistance of the DCI.
What Mollie’s parents and family must be going through when something like this happens.

lynda said...

It has been confirmed that it is NOT Mollie Tibbets

JoAnn said...

Hopefully, someone from law enforcement was able to reach Mollie’s parents ahead of news reports & tell them they knew the identity of this young woman.

Anonymous said...

http://theconservativecartel.com/mollie-tibbetts-dad-i-believe-shes-still-alive-and-with-somebody-she-knows/

Unknown said...

Peter, you should cover Urban Meyer's statement. It's too long, virtue signal-y, vague, and suspicious. He's lying.

Charlotte said...

I dont understand why it is necessary to question why the boyfriend is alibiing himself. If he is innocent, he must be terrified that he may be implicated in Mollie's disapearance.

He is likely young, and "only" her boyfriend, not her father. His main concern will be for himself, until he is cleared of suspition.
As much as it is morally wrong, it is human nature.

Barbara said...

Because statistically when a woman is killed or goes missing, a current/past romantic partner is usually responsible. Also because she was staying with him in his house when she reportedly went missing. And because he claims he received the last communication from her.

tania cadogan said...

off topic

A Vermont man accused of murdering his wealthy grandfather and then his mother to collect his inheritance is attempting to access his trust fund.

Nathan Carman, who has Asperger's, was barred from accessing the trust by his aunt who believes the 24-year-old is responsible for the deaths of his rich grandfather, John Chakalos, and his mother Linda Carman.

Carman is now requesting that his aunt, Valerie Santilli, be removed as trustee of the Nathan Carman Family Trust - which was set up for him by Chakalos in 2011 and is worth about $270,000 - after she denied his request for $150,000 for legal expenses.

He says he needs legal representation to defend himself against a slayer lawsuit filed by Santilli and her two sisters, Elaine Chakalos, and Charlene Gallagher, who believe Carman murdered his mother and grandfather to get his hands on a slice of Chakalos' $29 million estate.

A slayer suit prevents a person inheriting or profiting from someone their victim's estate. If successful, it would mean prevent Carman, who has not been charged in connection with either death, from ever collecting his $7 million share of the inheritance.

The hearing over Carman's trust fund is set for Tuesday afternoon.

Carman was a suspect in Chakalos' death after the wealthy 87-year-old real estate developer was shot and killed in his Vermont home in 2013, but a prosecutor rejected a warrant for his arrest pending more information.

Three years later, Carman went on a fishing trip with his mother Linda, 54, who disappeared when the boat sank off the coast of Rhode Island.

Carman is still fighting an insurer in federal court who is attempting to avoid paying out its $85,000 policy, claiming that the 24-year-old made suspicious alterations to the boat before it sank.

Meanwhile, Carman has been arguing that he would never have murdered his grandfather because he was a golden goose who would have kept him rich.

Court documents unsealed in May, reveal that Carman had his rent, utilities and education paid for by the multi-millionaire property developer until he was murdered in December 2013.

He claimed that, if anything, he has lost out financially as a result of his grandfather's death.

Carman says as well as the 'love and personal support for each other which my grandfather and I shared in our [familial] relationship', he had been bestowed with countless financial and social benefits.

The 24-year-old had his rent of $2,400, as well as the lease of his furniture - totaling more than $1,000 a month - and utilities including cable television, paid by Chakalos every month. The young man was given a credit card with a $5,000 limit which was paid off every month, and gifted a Nissan pickup truck worth $20,000.

He claimed Chakalos had also offered to pay his living and educational expenses for the remainder of his schooling before his death, a promise that went unfulfilled as a result of his shooting.

Carman revealed in his statement that his grandfather had initially offered to purchase him a brand new Ford F-150 pickup truck, with a value of $50,000.

He claims the offer was retracted after 'angry and persistent criticism from my aunts Valerie and Elaine', who were upset the value of the car far exceeded the value of a car purchased by Chakalos for his cousin.

Chakalos, a Second World War veteran, was shot dead at his home in Windsor, Vermont in 2013, just weeks after Carman's grandmother died of cancer.

The lawsuit says that a police investigation found Carman had bought a semi-automatic rifle from a gun store in New Hampshire that matched the same caliber weapon used in his grandfather's killing.


tania cadogan said...

cont.

The document says he concealed the information from investigators and now says the weapon is missing.

In July 2014, Windsor police submitted an arrest warrant for Carman on a murder charge, but a prosecutor rejected it the next day and returned it with a 'request for further information.'

Carman told the Hartford Courant at the time: 'He loved me very dearly,' he added. 'I was like a son to him; he was like a father to me.'

Carman is also the sole heir to his mother Linda Carman, 54, who went missing after the pair went on a fishing trip in September 2016.

He was rescued at sea a week later, and the search for Linda was called off after the Coast Guard said there was no chance of her still being alive.

In a recording of the phone call Carman made to the Coast Guard after he was rescued by a freighter, he said he heard a 'funny noise' in the engine compartment of his boat and then saw water pouring in before he lost sight of his mother.

Carman admitted he'd patched some holes on the 31-foot-long Chicken Pox with marine putty before the trip, he insisted the boat was seaworthy.

But insurance companies claimed in court that 'incomplete, improper, and faulty repairs' were made the day before the boat sank.

Carman later told ABC's '20/20' that he's misunderstood and an easy target for police because he suffers from Asperger's syndrome, a condition on the autism spectrum. A few of its hallmarks are awkward social and communication skills.

Carman has denied killing both his mother and his grandfather, and has not been criminally charged over their deaths.

As police executed a search warrant on his apartment in 2014, one neighbor told police Carman was 'a time bomb waiting to go off', and another referred to him as 'murder boy', based on their personal experience with him.

One officer also spoke with family members, who claimed they were so concerned for their personal safety they had hired private armed security details for their homes.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6035561/Man-linked-relatives-deaths-seeks-access-trust-fund.html

Peter Hyatt said...

Charlotte said...
I dont understand why it is necessary to question why the boyfriend is alibiing himself. If he is innocent, he must be terrified that he may be implicated in Mollie's disapearance.

He is likely young, and "only" her boyfriend, not her father. His main concern will be for himself, until he is cleared of suspition.
As much as it is morally wrong, it is human nature.

August 7, 2018 at 3:15 PM


Any statement from anyone is worthy of discernment. This is the point of Statement Analysis and allows not only to indicate guilt, but innocence.

Peter

Anonymous said...

Here’s the most recent interview from last evening with Mollies family. https://whotv.com/2018/08/07/13raw-tibbetts-family-keeping-hope-alive-that-mollie-will-come-home-safe/

John mcgowan said...

"Eyes For Lies"

Bold By Me

...

Missing Mollie Tibbetts and Wayne Cheney

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JFQH8xbo1k


Many of you have seen Wayne Cheney talk to the media about his interview with law enforcement in the case of missing Mollie Tibbetts.

The interview is interesting on many levels. I know it has caught many people’s attention.

Does Wayne Cheney show any indications of involvement in this interview?

Does he send up red flags?

From this interview, I can tell you that you cannot rule him in or out by the interview segments I have seen, and here is why.

Cheney comes across as a unique individual, perhaps someone who doesn’t socialize very much with people. He also has stalking charges in his past. With that, doing an interview with the media may be awkward for him whether he is telling the truth or lying. Hence, his answers in this video could be explained simply by being uncomfortable and not guilty or involved. Then again, they could be uncomfortable because he is involved. It could be both!

If Cheney was a normal guy who was actively social, then yes, his answers would flag me tremendously. But if he is a social recluse, keeping to himself, and rarely interacting with people day-to-day, along with his history of stalking, I can’t put much into his responses.

He clearly self-soothes in this interview but as to why, we need more information to say. If I were working on this case,
I would definitely want to do more interviews, though, without question!

If you see more interviews in this case, keep me posted.

http://www.eyesforlies.com/blog/2018/08/missing-mollie-tibbetts-and-wayne-cheney/

Anonymous said...

https://abcnews.go.com/GMA/iowa-man-person-mollie-tibbetts/story?id=57119283


Iowa man says 'maybe I was the last person to see' Mollie Tibbetts

snipped

An Iowa man said police officers searched his home in connection to the case of Mollie Tibbetts, the University of Iowa student who vanished last month after going for an evening jog.

In an exclusive interview with "Good Morning America" on Thursday, Devin Riley said he contacted the Powoshiek County Sheriff's Office in Central Iowa after Tibbetts was reported missing, telling officers that he may have been "the last person to see her."

Tibbetts was reported missing after she failed to show up for work in Brooklyn, Iowa, a farming community of about 1,500 people where the 20-year-old was living over the summer with her longtime boyfriend.

"I wish I did know more, but I dread that maybe I was the last person to see her," Riley said. "I remembered seeing her that night. I just felt very weird. Who knows when she was taken in that timeline, but I don't know what happened.

"I've seen her probably three to four times per week. She'd kind of jog down the street and towards the hill," he said. "I thought nothing of it until I heard somebody was missing, and it really hit me that I hadn't seen that runner since then."

"I remember her," he added. "She was wearing like a neon pink sports bra with black khaki yoga pants and an armband with her music device, or phone ... hair in a ponytail, just jogging like normal, any other day."

Riley said he was hesitant to come forward at first but decided to when he saw her family's pleas for help. It wasn't long before investigators showed up to his home, asking for "a walk through, or search,” he said.

"It was pretty terrifying at the beginning because I didn't know what was going on," he said. "I panicked and I put my girls in the bathroom, but they were really polite ... just did the walk through and were out in like 10 to 15 minutes."

Tania Bowman said...

Maybe it's just me but when this guy (who might be the last person to see her before the abduction) said: "but I dread that maybe I was the last person to see her." alarm bells sort of went off in my head. The words I dread seems kind of inappropriate here as if he knew it's a dreaded outcome particularly if he was the one who took her and killed her. It's like in his head, something terrible has happened to her beyond being abducted? and too, the words I dread almost sound like she's dead...guess I'm reading too much into this here and am just not good at SA. :)

Lars said...

I think the pig farmer did it. His body language was closed and he said 'this is a waste of tine'. How could any feeling person think that helping law enforcement find a misding girl could be a waste of his time. It shows a cold callous mind. I am nit good at this stuff either, but alarm bells are going off with the pig farmer.

Lars said...

Someone on here wrote something so ridiculous about the parents and brother commenting about Molly having her life all planned out from college to buying a house to marriage and that was "sensitive". What the heck did the commenter mean by that?! Of course they are going to say that! They are projecting grief into the future.

Lucia D said...

I agree the Wayne ( the pig farmer) is incredibly awkward and suspicious. But from what I see there this guy is very unsocialized, the next step up from non verbal for an adult. I’m not sure he could utter a reliable denial even if he was coached. Sad.

Lars said...

Lucia; yeah I dunno I just get tons of alarm bells off him. Her poor Dad is falling apart and both Mom and Dad are angelicizing her because they know deep down it's not good.

Dave said...

Lars I'm wondering if the pig farmer knows more than he's saying. Could "waste" be leakage? Red shirt was found near to his property.

Dave said...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7WFoW7FIMnY

I don't know if this is relevant, but there is a small clip of footage shot by a fellow camp counselor (male) the day before her disappearance. They then show a still photo of Molly on a bus (looks like feom a previous outing wearing a red shirt odentical to the counselor next to her with white lettering. She is snuggled into the camp counselor on a bus maybe on a different field trip. They look like they are just friends. I don't know if this means Molly already had a camp-issued red shirt or if my vision is tricking me. Maybe she lost that ahirt and needed to borrow one from her Mom. My heart bleeds for all her loved ones.

Tania Bowman said...

Just watched the clip you are talking about (camp counselor leaning next to him) well maybe I'm just too suspicious but perhaps in her mind, they were just friends but it looks to me as if he might have taken it differently. As a female who likes male companionship, if I was next to my camp counselor like that, he would probably have gotten the wrong idea. In no way am I saying her morals were bad, no way but men and sometimes women get mixed signals between caring and sexual leanings. Mollie's father said he thought she might have left with someone she knew and trusted, maybe she did leave with this camp counselor? Her father seemed to infer that it was someone who was in over their heads. I would think something like a situation with the camp counselor could be something over his head if he did indeed take her. I got the feeling that it was someone who had a crush on her that committed this act.

flightfulbird said...

I just watched the clip - - and for whatever it's worth, the part on the bus where she is cruising with the camp counselor and has her head on his shoulder definitely gives me the idea that this guy could've gotten the wrong idea. Thinking that she liked him romantically and not just as a counselor. Or hoping if they could be alone, she would see him as more than just her counselor.

I too have a bad feeling about this.

Dave said...

Tania Bowman, I am very bad at body language, I thought it looked like caring or loving body language but I didn't feel confident to say. What do you think happened to the camp-issued shirt? Do you think maybe it needed to be washed and that is why she borrowed a red shirt from her Mom? I am fairly new to SA, but I think the boyfriend and Mom and Dad do not have red flags in their language. Maybe her camp counselor friend is in over his head, like the Dad said. The boyfriend does not seem like the jealous type and Molly sent him that Snapchat picture so I don't see how they could have been fighting or anything. I can't see him yelling or being mean.

Anonymous said...

One statement the pig farmer made is " I don't know her" in present tense. He didn't say "I didn't know her". My belief is it wasn't him.

Anonymous said...

what do you make of the boyfriend saying "i'm the one who threw up red flags that she was missing"?

Peter Hyatt said...

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/12814/sweden-antisemitism

John mcgowan said...

Mollie Tibbetts search: Farmer who has repeatedly been questioned admits to taking polygraph test


The farmer who has repeatedly been questioned in relation to the disappearance of college student Mollie Tibbetts tells Fox News he took a polygraph test earlier this week in Brooklyn, Iowa, the city where she was last seen more than three weeks ago.

Wayne Cheney, who at times has appeared guarded in media interviews, said authorities did question him about Tibbetts during the polygraph and asked if he has anything to do with her disappearance.

But Cheney once again said to Fox News on Thursday he has nothing to do with her disappearance and that “some guy probably has her.”

Cheney added he doesn’t know the results of his Tuesday lie detector test. He has not been publicly named as a suspect or person of interest in the case, has not been charged with a crime and said he “has nothing to hide.”

He also initially refused to take the test, according to reports.

During an interview with Fox News late last week, Cheney said he would allow the FBI to search his entire property; he expressed confidence the bureau wouldn't find anything. So far, he said, the FBI has searched his home, some of his property and his cellphone.

He also told Fox News he has never seen Tibbetts before, because he doesn't venture into Brooklyn, Iowa, where she was staying, several miles from his home.



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/08/09/mollie-tibbetts-search-farmer-who-has-repeatedly-been-questioned-admits-to-taking-polygraph-test.html

Peter Hyatt said...

A few comments:

Anonymous said...
One statement the pig farmer made is " I don't know her" in present tense. He didn't say "I didn't know her". My belief is it wasn't him.
August 10, 2018 at 4:24 AM


I generally don't comment on anonymous postings, as I prefer to respond if appropriate to a specific person who may be attempting to learn. The exception is when a teachable moment arises.


With regard to the quote above and opinion: This is not accurate. Consider that, first, it is far too small a sample to know anything. Then there is the entire context issue.



Also, I have not seen, nor read here, enough from the Pig farmer to discern anything.

It is important for students to embrace self restraint in analysis.

If they wish to make a guess, they should be identify it as such. Especially in public, I avoid guessing due to the potential impact not only for others, but upon myself. This is why analysts, even when working together, avoid assertions, opting instead for questions. We can psychologically make it difficult for ourselves to receive correction, whether it be from the instructor, colleagues, or, best of all: from the statement itself.

It is how error damages the analysis and the analyst's own confidence.

******************************************************************************************************************

The boyfriend is, indeed, withholding information. It may be, however, that he has done so according to law enforcement directive. The info is case related, though I do not know its level of importance.

The father's language does not indicate guilty knowledge.
The mother and brother indicate failing confidence, as does the father, with assertions to the contrary.

They hope, but they are fighting against doubt.

Peter

Peter Hyatt said...

Dave,

Body language analysis is best suited for survival technique; not discerning deception.

The inclusion of so many factors, including psychotropic medications, cultural shifts away from bodily exercise, and so on.
The training of such has not produced solid results outside of military, combat, personal protection (etc) training. For undercover, sting as well as various forms of intelligence gathering, it is very useful to learn the signals of increased aggression. Those with military armed engagement quickly develop these skills.

Although I cannot support this with data, I think that civilian women who study guides on basic aggression body language can, indeed, be safer.



Joe Navaro has an interesting article up on why it cannot be used in detecting deception. This was particularly of interest after former director, James Comey said "my experts present said Gen. Flynn was not being deceptive in the interview" --- Comey does not possess investigatory experience of note.


Books on body language sell, and the "short cut" analysis is very appealing.

John, the micro expression movement has all but given up the ghost.

The science behind it remains sound. But the training has not produced any results that I am aware of, nor have been informed by others in the field. The "flash card" training has not worked and there continue to be residual experts from the TV show, but not law enforcement professionals engaged in active investigations.

Very few investigators have the time to watch a video in frame by frame context, to stop, discern an emotion and add this to the investigation.

The science is fascinating but with several years of attempting to train, it is a failure.

The appeal of "seeing" what no one else "sees" appeals to our need to be "special" and "unique." It has given birth to "Facebook psychics" and the like.

*******************************************************************************

Nothing gives information like the words a person chooses. This brings not only a very high success rate, but it maintains it, through study, application and self discipline.

If it was easy, everyone'd be doing it.

It is a skill that any reasonable person can acquire but it will take lots of training and even more hours of practice.

A lot of people can strum a guitar or hit a note on a piano, but to play a complete song and do so accurately, means the person has put in the hours necessary.

Anything worth while in life, is worth our effort.

If Foxnews journalist who interviewed the Pig farmer had training, we'd have a definitive opinion.



Peter

John mcgowan said...

Hi, Peter

i think is maybe the article you're referring to.


Joe Navarro M.A.
Spycatcher

The End of Detecting Deception
Body-language can help us detect when there are issues — not deception
Posted Jul 15, 2018


https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/spycatcher/201807/the-end-detecting-deception

Mike Dammann said...

What do you make out of this?

In an exclusive interview with "Good Morning America" on Thursday, Devin Riley said he contacted the Powoshiek County Sheriff's Office in Central Iowa after Tibbetts was reported missing, telling officers that he may have been "the last person to see her."

Tibbetts was reported missing after she failed to show up for work in Brooklyn, Iowa, a farming community of about 1,500 people where the 20-year-old was living over the summer with her longtime boyfriend.

"I wish I did know more, but I dread that maybe I was the last person to see her," Riley said. "I remembered seeing her that night. I just felt very weird. Who knows when she was taken in that timeline, but I don't know what happened.

"I've seen her probably three to four times per week. She'd kind of jog down the street and towards the hill," he said. "I thought nothing of it until I heard somebody was missing, and it really hit me that I hadn't seen that runner since then."

"I remember her," he added. "She was wearing like a neon pink sports bra with black khaki yoga pants and an armband with her music device, or phone ... hair in a ponytail, just jogging like normal, any other day."

Riley said he was hesitant to come forward at first but decided to when he saw her family's pleas for help. It wasn't long before investigators showed up to his home, asking for "a walk through, or search,” he said.

"It was pretty terrifying at the beginning because I didn't know what was going on," he said. "I panicked and I put my girls in the bathroom, but they were really polite ... just did the walk through and were out in like 10 to 15 minutes."

How can he be "the last person to see her." if whoever has her or killed her would be the ones who saw her alive last? Riley said he was hesitant to come forward why?
"It was pretty terrifying at the beginning because I didn't know what was going on,"

What part is terrifying if all you do is forward important info that couldn't implicate you in a crime?

"I panicked and I put my girls in the bathroom, but they were really polite ... just did the walk through and were out in like 10 to 15 minutes."

Doesn't "bathroom" show unnecessary information and what would that indicate?

Humble observation said...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Du0-9vZibs

Right around the 55 second mark

"It is (in)conceivable that Molly is with someone she knows..."

In this 1 amd 1/2 minute interview we hear:

"taken on a life of it's own"

"(in)conceivable" >>>>>>>>>>>>>> CONCEIVE

People do leak things out in this way. He is talking about something else, however, people leak out clues. I have noticed it in my own life, because they are thinking about whatever it is they don't want to let slip.

Lucia D said...

The more I study, the more I see - our words give us away.

Dave said...

Peter-
Thank you for your response! I have never been good at body language, and it is interesting to know it is not particularly useful in the detection of deception. This blog is fascinating, and I have been going back reading some of the older posts to try to learn all I can. It is intriguing as well as enjoyable, and I hope to make progress, if even slowly. There sure are a group of interesting characters in this case such as the pig farmer, and I must say I laughed out loud at your comment about FOX news!
Wonderful blog you have, Sir!

Dave

Mike Dammann said...

"I remember her," he added. "She was wearing like a neon pink sports bra with black khaki yoga pants and an armband with her music device, or phone ... hair in a ponytail, just jogging like normal, any other day."


It is way too detailed as Amber pointed out above. I couldn't tell you what my friend was wearing who just left. A blue shirt is all I can tell you for sure. This is not the account of someone who just happened to see someone. This is more like an account of someone who was actively observing someone.

Mike Dammann said...

I would report her right away. I would not worry about being a witness seeing someone jog by. He seems very strange. Everything he says is just "off".

I see women jogging in sports bras all the time and don't see why not. Unless you live in Sweden or somewhere where women are instructed to cover themselves "properly" or it may be "their own fault" if they get assaulted.

I used to run shirtless even when I was fat and didn't care about the (then negative) attention I may have drawn.

Mike Dammann said...

Amber, I have just watched the interview with him and also didn't "get an off vibe". He seemed more embarrassed than anything else as he should be for waiting so long to report her sighting. So yes, it could be that his attention was drawn to her due to her appearance causing him to look her over and notice certain things. But still: I am actively thinking back at a very attractive woman I have seen 5 days ago, but I cannot tell you what she was wearing for sure. I think she wore jeans. She was tall, but I still cannot say if she was wearing high heels or just tall. I would guess a dark colored shirt, but probably be wrong about that.

His account of her is unusually detailed. Watching the interview was quite different from reading his statement which did show potential red flags. But there was no indication of deception from what I've seen. But I still cannot look at running as a sports bra as "immodest". Maybe I have lived by the beach in San Diego for many years, I am seeing it as the norm and it is differently viewed in other parts of the country.

Mike Dammann said...

I just looked at her Facebook profile and she is always modestly dressed. So you do have a point. So since we are not supposed to look for body language and how we feel about someone's innocence of guilt, I would say that based on his statement alone he shouldn't be eliminated as a suspect.

Charlie said...

I agree, Mike, Anber's posts were off the charts offensive!

Billy90 said...

Amber, if you're reading, that is ludicrus to say thst was a detaled description! Just because he noted what she was wearing?! I remember what people where right down to there shoelaces!

Also, if LE thought it was concerning, thry would have searched his house!

Rob90 said...

I watched the video posted by Humble Observation.

I notice

"taken on a life of its own"
"(in)conceivable" --------conceive. conception
"compromise"-------compromised

Is it weird Molly talked to her father on the phone for 3 hours the day she went missing?

Tania Bowman said...

Dave said, Tania Bowman, I am very bad at body language, I thought it looked like caring or loving body language but I didn't feel confident to say. What do you think happened to the camp-issued shirt? Do you think maybe it needed to be washed and that is why she borrowed a red shirt from her Mom? I am fairly new to SA, but I think the boyfriend and Mom and Dad do not have red flags in their language. Maybe her camp counselor friend is in over his head, like the Dad said. The boyfriend does not seem like the jealous type and Molly sent him that Snapchat picture so I don't see how they could have been fighting or anything. I can't see him yelling or being mean.

Dave, I am really bewildered now because a few people have called me out on the camp counselor photo as in it was a very caring body language. I only know I've seen my 16 yr. old granddaughter in that very same postured position with her 16 yr. old boyfriend. Yes, on the one hand, it is a very caring look but as a grandmother, I felt with my granddaughter pictured in the very same way knowing she was pretty young to be next to the boy she cared about, vice versa he cared for her as well. My granddaughter and this boy have since broken up (she was too young to date but then I'm not her mother) and it almopst devestated her. So having seen the very same kind of embrace with Molli and the camp counselor, I got the feeling that maybe it was platonic with Molli but not the camp counselor, like he might have had more feelings for her than she for him. When her father said that the person might know Molli and that they might be in over their head then I thought perhaps it is this counselor who took her. That's until I saw the interview with the man who supposedly was the last to see Molli jogging by his house. He was quite descriptive of what she was wearing right down to the wrist and what she was carrying in her hand. Unless Molli wore that complete outfit every day, I'd think a neighbor might not remember on an exact day right down to something on the wrist and what exact colors she wore that day but then thats just me. I'm just a novice at SA too but time doesn't permit me to learn it as quickly as I'd like.

Lucia D said...

A coworker who is from Iowa told me how common human trafficking is there. Apparently the central location and proximity to major interstate highways have made it a hotbed of trafficking abductions. This would explain the lack of guilt in the language of her family and boyfriend. It would explain why no remains have been found.

Imagrandma said...

Blogger Tania,

I think it looked like romantic body language from both. However, I saw an interview with the guy she was snuggling with and he seems like he might be gay.
Amber had broughgt up the detailed description of clothing and that is apparently off limits to discuss, so please respect that.

Imagrandma said...

Lucia,

She was taken by someone who knew she was alone in that house most likely because it would allow a lengthy time period between when she was taken and when it was realized she was missing, so that the perp would be able to drive her body far from where she was taken to delay discovery of that body till it is so decomposed there will be no evidence left. Whoever took her knew her & knew she would be alone because her boyfriend, brother & his fiance were gone.

Anonymous said...

Off Topic: Is there a rule on instagram banning people from spelling, using appropriate verb tenses, or forming anything resembling a sentence? Holy God.

Anonymous said...

I recently came across this account from a young male comedian publically accusing another of sexual assault. I found the use of language very peculiar.

JooYung Roberts
9 June ·

cw: sexual assault
tl;dr: Our Defamation Laws Encourage a Culture of Sexual Violence and Cover-Ups

Today is the 9th of June 2018, which marks four years since Tom Ballard, host of the ABC television show Tonightly, indecently assaulted me. With this post, I aim to describe what happened, offer a small amount of advice to survivors, and shed some light on what I view as one of the greatest challenges facing the Me Too movement in Australia.

Despite countless high profile figures in the United States being publicly accused of sexual harrassment or assault, very few allegations have been made public in Australia for one big reason: Defamation law. Defamation laws in Australia are among the strictest in the world, to the extent that in some cases victims are sued by their rapists for telling people the truth of what happened between them. Somebody once told me that if Harvey Weinstein had done what he did in Australia he would have gotten away with it, the Me Too movement wouldn’t exist and countless survivors would still be living in darkness. Think on that for a moment. Think of the Catholic Church. Within this country, if powerful figures are to be held accountable, the onus truly and unfairly is placed on victims to get their stories out there by whatever means are available. That is of course at terrible, terrible risk to themselves. So, here we go.

I go to his hotel room after a gig; eager to learn about the art form I’ve been practicing for a month, not knowing what’s about to happen. He offers me a glass of port wine. What fun we are having, I think. He finishes his glass, reaches over and grabs my glass, takes a sip then hands it back. He kisses me then. Sticks his tongue right into my mouth. I keep my eyes on the television. The King of Late Night Television, David Letterman, is on TV. He grabs the remote. “This is terrible,” he says, switches off the TV and continues the assault. If it’s terrible, why is he doing it?

My body writhed as I did everything I could to avoid penetration. Anything but penetration. And I’ll leave when I can. And you know, it’s true that the inherent power imbalance between men and women is that men are bigger and stronger and they can do what they want. I left eventually, as politely as I could, but not before he had placed my hand on his penis and placed his mouth on mine, and not before being placed face forward against a counter and desperately turning around. No not that. It wasn’t sex. It was a power struggle.

Days later I went to the police knowing a man who molests one person doesn’t molest only one. I wanted to make sure he didn’t assault anyone else. But I hadn’t said no. I hadn’t said stop. Or if I had it wasn’t clear enough. I’d been too scared to. I didn’t know how. He had molested me but he knew what he was doing. He hadn’t gone outside of the confines of the law. And there wasn’t really anything that could be done so I left the station safe in that knowledge. I decided to live my life.

Me Too didn’t come for three and a half years and in that time my mental health just got worse and worse. I didn’t seek therapy. I didn’t let people in the Australian comedy community know about what had happened. It was a secret that had to be kept, desperately, for the sake of my career. My advice to victims is: If you’re suffering from trauma get professional help. Don’t wait. Get it now. Trust me when I say this: You don’t want to know what rock bottom looks like. Recovery is possible but it takes deliberate and sustained effort.


(It continues on after this) This is a link to the original post: https://www.facebook.com/jooyung.roberts.94/posts/10215402976085366

And this is the accused's public denial:
http://tomballard.com.au/a-statement/

Ella said...

Peter, the brother made the comment: hopefully she will resurface ....what do you make of that?

Peter Hyatt said...

It’s consistent w what the family is saying that she’s gone underground w someone that she shouldn’t be with...

These are weak assertions by the family. Very sad.

Peter Hyatt said...

https://youtu.be/8qNfAqedSIo

Dave said...

Ella, resurface = under water?

Excited that Peter posted s video, love his videos. Can't wait tio watch!

Dave said...

Peter, Excellent video! So interesting about the sensitivity if the use of the negstive. I bet you would enjoy the youtube video if Trey Gowdy interrogating Peter Strok of you haven't already seen it.

I always wonder about how sensitive is it if someone is accused if something, and instead of immediately issuing a denial, they "describe" what they have been accused of.

For example "You cheated on me before."

Denial begins: "Cheating is wrong."

or

"You used cocaine"

Denial begins "Cocaine is crazy."

How sensitive is that?

Anonymous said...

Mollie Tibbets: Twitter: Mollie Tibbetts @Motibbs 8 Feb 2017
Sometimes I want to take all the money I have and just go as far as it'll take me.

Just wondering if she had wanderlust really bad and maybe she just had to get away anonymously? Maybe things were escalating into 2018 to the near breaking point? Granted that was posted in 2017 but she also posted how she had struggled with her weight/body image, school workload. Just possible that the relationship with her boyfriend Dalton was moving too fast and she had to get away from him? Who knows, just some thoughts based on some of her Twitter postings.

Dave said...

Anon @ 2:46,

That is interesting. It's also possible that whatever was making her want to get far away got her.

ShEilaT said...

Anon--

I'n not sure, but I think there was another case we looked at where the missing young lady had written something similar on one of her social media accounts.

Mike Dammann said...

Despite the suggestions Mollie could have taken off with someone she knows and be in hiding, the family clearly does not entertain that which the language shows. They know Mollie and that she wouldn't put them through what they are going through. It can be a very painful experience when you know the harsh reality deep inside yet others want to make you feel better with something that makes what really happened even clearer. This can contribute to doubt being expressed by them.

Mike Dammann said...

There are people who prefer false hope to having no hope. Others get triggered by it. It brings the reality even more to the forefront. This family appears to be grounded in reality. No matter how harsh.

Mike Dammann said...

Within their language, the family is telling the public that they want answers and that they can take it as long as it's the truth. And much of it could be in response to what friends have said to them beforehand. Which we don't have a record of.

Still Learning said...

Mike--It is odd though when we see "foreshadowing" of a disappearance in cases. I DO NOT believe Molly left with someone she knew in order to escape reality or go on an adventure. The "foreshadowing" should be analyzed carefully.

Still Learning said...

One thing that jumped out at me from Molly's statement on twitter was this:

"just go AS FAR as it'll take me."

She does not say "just go as FAR AWAY as it'll take me"

Could there be some unconscious knowledge she had that she wouldn't get "AWAY" from whatever she was trying to get distance from? Why did she omit that word?



Still Learning said...

"JUST go as far as it'll take me"

NOT go as far away as I can and start a new life"

There is a linguistic element where the "journey" has no clear destination or goal. This is someone who wants to get away from someone or somerhing specific as their main focus.

Anonymous said...

That's what I wondered....if trying to get away from a sad situation or someone she was a slight friend to that was trying to cling to her?

Anonymous said...

You think she was fleeing the allegedly clingy camp counselor? She seened to like him, not be like oh ick plus I think it would have to be more dire situation for her to flee. But yeah. Foreshadowing. Any other clues? The Dad spoke to her for 3 hrs that day? Looks like case will go cold.

Anonymous said...

Never said Mollie might be fleeing the camp counselor but he could be smitten with her although many have said he is gay, so I doubt it's him. I was thinking more along the lines about that wedding in the Dominican Republic. I believe I read somewhere that her Bf was going to propose to her down there. If true, then maybe she wasn't quite ready to commit to a piece of legal paper (wedding certificate)? Also, her father seems to think she left with someone she knows, he must have an inkling why he thinks so but isn't allowed to say at this point? The father has reiterated this point over and over. I know Peter hasn't found any kind of deception with the father's words so that even bolsters my thoughts that the father might be right.

Dave said...

Anonymous, I very much doubt she is alive. The father may be in denial. With her face everywhere & even if she was paying for things with cash, she would have run out if cash by now.
She could have just broken things off with her boyfriend if things weee that stressful.
Mollie has posted that her brothers used to choke her until she passed out. Where did they learn that kind of behavior & her father did not put a stop to it? They just felt like it was OK to choke their sister? Why is this clue regarding serious violence beinv perpetrared on Mollie being ignired? What if pog garmer had a history of choking people till they were unconscious? Heavy suspicion would fall on him. Well, heavy suspicion should be falling on the brothers and anyone who taught them that behavior or enabled it. It is highly abnormal behavior & highly lethal behavior.

Mike Dammann said...

Apparently police believe that she is still alive and being held against her will.

Dave said...

"Apparently"? What is the source of your info? If police believe that, they are very stupid because THAT NEVER HAPPENS. Girl feld captive against her will for months. Once in a blue moon it happens.
Suicide maybe?
Held captive? No.
My best gueds is a predator got her, perhaps in the context of her hitchhiking to flee that God forsaken cornfield of a town as well as the dweebie no personality xbox player boyfriend. And predoatir probably got her.

Mike Dammann said...

Set your comment location, who can comment on your posts, and other settings:
Select Embedded, to allow you or readers to respond to other comments on the post.
In “Who Can Comment,” select User with Google Accounts to restrict anonymous commenting.
Choose how often to approve comments with "Comment Moderation."
https://support.google.com/blogger/answer/187141?hl=en

Dave said...

Mike, It doesnt really look like your comments are beimg flooded with responses, but feel free to restrict comments. You will be lucky if you get a single response moderated or unmoderated.

I allow anyone to respond to my posts.

Mike Dammann said...

Her body has been found:
https://twitter.com/search?q=%22Mollie%20Tibbetts%22&src=tren

George G. George said...

The boyfriend's statement indicated that he was withholding information. Was he withholding info he learned from LE? Does SA indicate the type of info being withheld? For instance, choosing to withhold info vs being told to withhold info?

George G. George said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Peter Hyatt said...

George G. George said...
The boyfriend's statement indicated that he was withholding information. Was he withholding info he learned from LE? Does SA indicate the type of info being withheld? For instance, choosing to withhold info vs being told to withhold info?
August 21, 2018 at 10:31 PM


I posted a comment that the boyfriend was withholding info and that it was likely from LE request.

A week later, he admitted as much.

That he was withholding info was via SA, but that it was from LE was guess work on my part, based upon the context of the missing info: the time period.

Peter

Nadine Lumley said...

It is not anti-semitic to criticize Israel for jailing, abusing and killing Palestine civilians fyi

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-10/why-swedish-government-funding-anti-semitism

.

Nadine Lumley said...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/spycatcher/201010/detecting-lies-vs-detecting-truth-serious-implications

.