Wednesday, October 16, 2013

New Prosecutor for Hailey Dunn Case?


Will Hailey Dunn finally receive justice?  Will her mother, Billie Jean Dunn, and her ex boyfriend, Shawn Adkins, finally answer for her death?


Gov. Rick Perry has named Benjamin Smith of Snyder as the lead prosecutor for the 132nd Judicial District in Borden and Scurry counties.
Smith will serve a term set to expire at the next general election.
Smith, currently the Borden County attorney and an assistant district attorney for the 132nd Judicial District, is a former partner at Hargrove and Smith Attorneys at Law. He also is a former municipal court judge for the city of Snyder.
He received a bachelor’s degree and law degree from Texas Tech University.

42 comments:

Suzanne said...

I hope Benjamin Smith is more of a "Juan Martinez" type of prosecutor rather than an "Alex Hunter" type of prosecutor....

Trigger said...

Is this about "fresh new eyes" looking at Hailey's murder case?

I hope that this prosecutor can put the evidence together in a way that will point the finger at Billie and Shawn, so there can be some closure.

Two evil cunning killers are walking free, while this girl was rotting in an "ugly field" without justice.

I hope that when the arrests come that everything is taped for all to see in the media, just like Scott Peterson, who was convicted of murder.

john said...

OT: I found this is very interesting

Misidentification:

Can you identify the criminal?

http://www.open.edu/openlearn/body-mind/psychology/misidentification-can-you-identify-the-criminal

S + K Mum said...

Interesting John!

Jen said...

I hope this is a step toward justice for Hailey.

BJD & SA's luck needs to run out...now!

Local anon said...

I am hoping for movement but not holding my breath.

marietje said...

I wrote to Gov. Perry asking that there be justice for Hailey. I think this a good sign and it is still not too late to write. You can google his office and there is a contact link there.

GetThem said...

Let's hope Benjamin Smith can catch up on his new case load quickly, including Hailey's. The last we thing we need is another prosecutor who walks on pins and needles and can't make a decision. Justice needs to come first.

Interesting he graduated and became an attorney, then a judge, went back to a prosecutor and is now the lead prosecutor. Sort of an unusual path. Usually once you get a judgeship, you're there for life.

Anonymous said...

Is this the new news you were referring to a bit ago regarding the Hailey Dunn case?


Your wording makes it seem as if Shawn were Hailey's bf, which of course, he wasn't, just food for thought.


Also, interested to see more postings by 'Buckley' and wondering if this is a poster from long ago on another site with the Casey Anthony thread? Thank you, Buckley, for bringing some common sense to the table of laptop detectives run amok, albeit, I am sure many have good intentions, they still get carried away from the principles of SA (and no one is perfect, of course we can all be sidetracked from things)

Anonymous said...

""Your wording makes it seem as if Shawn were Hailey's bf""

In Shawn's head he was......

dadgum said...

OT
Everyone who uses SA on posts/comments, please raise your hands.

And how many of you have gone back to correct a comment, after looking at it as you think others here will?

Anonymous said...

dadgum, I've done that my whole life, before ever learning of SA. I used to be so careful trying not to unintentionally offend anyone that I reviewed everything in my head after I said it, in case it could be understood in a way I hadn't intended, then I'd explain what I meant if I thought of a way of a way they could have heard me that could be taken the wrong way. It could be very irritating to me and to the other people. I've never been a good communicator to begin with and so many things can be taken in more ways than one. I used to drive myself crazy over-thinking my words. I had to let it go and decide to let people make of it what they would.
I still do the same with other peoples' words, giving them the benefit of the doubt, assuming they mean no offense, unless or until they give me reason to think otherwise.
The way I understand it, that's why the more quotes there are to analyze the more confidence we can have in conclusions drawn using SA and why we should highlight the written words using colored markers. Some things like pronouns aren't a matter of internal, subjective dictionaries and are of higher concern that other words. At least that's my understanding of SA at this point. Am I getting it yet?

Ian said...

The British police have just released a transcript of an interview with Jimmy Savile from 2009 where he denies allegations of carrying out sexual abuse. Huge scandal in England, the ramifications will go on for years, he died before it all came out without any justice for the presumed hundreds of victims. The interview demonstrates how terrible the police were at investigating, with numerous red flags, almost a textbook case of deception. A very interesting read.

http://www.theguardian.com/media/interactive/2013/oct/16/jimmy-savile-police-interview-transcript

john said...

OT Update:

Sandy Parsons hope all his children will be reunited under one roof.

SALISBURY, N.C. -- As local and federal authorities continue their investigation into the disappearance of Erica Parsons, her adoptive parents visited their biological children Tuesday.

Sandy Parsons told NBC Charlotte his desire was to have all of his children back home.

Sandy and Casey arrived at the Rowan County courthouse Tuesday afternoon for their scheduled weekly visit with the two children DSS took from them days after a missing person’s report was filed for Erica.

The meeting lasted about an hour, and as in the past, Sandy had nothing to say to the media as he left. Casey slipped out through another door.

Their attorney did speak, though, saying the family hopes Erica will be found safe.

"I THINKS she's alive". I THINK she’s out there somewhere. DON'T know where and just the way things have happened, it APPEARED that Casey and Sandy where duped by this woman, and I THINK she's out there somewhere,” Carlyle Sherill said of Nan, the woman Casey and Sandy say they left Erica with.

"I THINK she's alive"

Leaving others to think differently.

I THINK she’s out there somewhere"

Again this Leaves others to think differently.

DON'T know where and just the way things have happened, it APPEARED that Casey and Sandy where duped by this woman, and I THINK she's out there somewhere,”

"DON'T Know."

Dropped pronoun.We must ask why he isn't committed and taking ownership of what he is saying ?.

"DON'T know"

Anything said in the negative we flag as sensitive.

"It APPEARED" = Seems like, uncertain.

I THINK she's out there somewhere,”

Here we have the word THINK x 3 cropping up again making it very sensitive.

To me he has no confidence in his language and in his clients. I would seriously "Think" of changing my Atty if he came out with a statement like this,and i was innocent.

http://www.wcnc.com/news/searching-for-erica/Sandy-Parsons-hope-all-his-children-will-be-reunited-under-one-roog-227914711.html

Anonymous said...

Me!!

Nic said...

I'm always hopeful but I won't hold my breath, either.

Anonymous said...

Anon at 5:43- thanks. I'm not the poster from the Casey Anthony site.

Buckley

Anonymous said...

Nobody cares!!! Fuck off!!!

Anonymous said...

Lol. :)

Shelley said...

So the new DA:


He is a member of the State Bar of Texas and Texas District and County Attorneys Association, and a past board member of the West Texas Children's Advocacy Center. He is also a lay leader at First United Methodist Church of Snyder, a member of the Snyder Independent School District Tiger Dads, and a past member of the Snyder Lions Club.



I would be interested in why he is a FORMER member Children's Advocacy Center. Depending on why, it could affect this case.

Otherwise his private time it appears was just general and so not sure he is as qualified as I would like. So not sure if this will get justice.

Only time will tell.

But we sure do need more Juan Martinez types who care about the victims and not trying to protect the criminals.

I also would be interested in the reasons there was a change.

Anonymous said...

To answer your two questions at the beginning of this article: No and no. IMO, Billie Jean & Shawn will never pay for what they did to sweet Hailey. Not in this lifetime.

Jen said...

Hi John- 

The Parsons' attorney Sherill has made several strange statements including these from the Dr Phil show concerning Sandy's failed polygraph (full segment linked below). Sherill does a pitiful job of conveying any confidence in  their innocence. When confronted with the results he flat out admits that their story makes no sense, then diverts from the topic of Sandy's obvious deception to debate the admissibility of polygraph results in NC courts. (As if that has anything to do with the idea that Sandy was determined as deceptive...they are on a TV show, not in a court room!)

Carlyle Sherill- "Uh, the, WE know that there are problems in what Sandy and Casey have been saying...uuuuhhh, as far as logically..... ummmmm, I don't know if he misread the, uh misinterpreted, the uh question, as far as the fact that they did in fact deliver her, and she's gone now."

(Dr Phil gets clarification from the polygrapher that Sandy could not have misunderstood the meaning of the question due to pre-interview, and provides some stats on the polygrapher's career in the FBI)

Carlyle Sherill- "Certainly accomplished at operating the polygraph, uh, of course those are not reliable, considered reliable in state courts here in N.C."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezt7GyIIxok&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Shelley said...

The recent suicide case where the 12 year old was bullied so much she commited suicide, this sheriff stated "i would arrest the suspects parents if I could"


Not only do I like that he is doing what he can in this case, I wish that we could get more DA's that had this mind set too.

Billie Dunn and Shawn Atkins need to be in jail.

Local anon said...

I agree Shelley, on both points.

Anonymous said...

OT: RE Erica Parsons

Sandy and Casey Parsons, Erica's adoptive parents reportedly told James that Erica had gone to live with her biological grandmother in Asheville. They have repeated that same explain in interviews with WBTV and on national interviews on the Dr. Phil show.

The Parsons said they haven't spoken with Erica since February 2012.

But online conversations obtained by WBTV show Casey Parsons giving Erica's biological mother updates on the teen's life as recently as March 2013. The conversations were obtained by WBTV reporter David Whisenant and confirmed as accurate by Erica's biological mother, Carolyn.


http://www.kptv.com/story/23341804/online-messages-show-contradictions-in-story-of-missing-teen?page=1&N=F

Anonymous said...

normally bullies would not have been arrested, but because the cop feared what they might do in the future, he arrested them.
afraid
might do
who is the bully now?
they have not committed a future crime yet.

Anonymous said...

The Parsons didn't have photos done in Locust. There is no Young's Photography. There is one near Lake Norman, where Mooresville is, and where they supposedly dropped Erica at McDonald's.

My2cents said...

Anon @3:19 said, "who is the bully now?
they have not committed a future crime yet."

Isn't a huge part of the reason to jail criminals to get them out of society and prevent continued crimes? Incarcerating offenders for what they've already done doesn't undo their crime.

It's a combination of paying for their crimes and prevention of future crimes.

Shelley said...

1 of 4


Hi Peter,

I have another historic murder mystery from 1873 to analyze when you have the time.
It is referred to as “Smuttynose Island Murders” as the occurred on Smuttynose Island at the Isles of Shoals in Maine.
In this case, the man they believed was responsible was tried, convicted and hung mainly due to the sole survivor, Maren Hontvet, testifying against him. Additionally, since money had been also stolen that night from the purse of one of the victims, not only did he have about that much money, but the button she had in her purse was later found in his pocket.
So while it seemed like a clear cut case, there was a rumor years later that the sole survivor on her death bed admitted she had actually been the murderer. She also divorced her husband after the murders and moved back to Norway where she was from.

The basic story line:
Near midnight on March 6, 1873 Anethe and Karen Christensen, Norwegian immigrants, were murdered on Smuttynose Island at the Isles of Shoals in Maine. Both women were strangled and one had also been hit with an ax. Survivor Maren Hontvet, the only other person on the island that night, named the killer as Louis Wagner, a German fisherman who had previously stayed at the island house when ill with rheumatism. Wagner had worked for Maren's husband John Hontvet, Anethe's husband Ivan, Wagnerhad been seen earlier that very evening in Portsmouth, NH where the Smuttynose fishermen were waiting for a load of fish bait to arrive by train. Wagner learned that the women were alone on the island and knew John was saving money there to buy a new fishing boat. He reportedly rowed to the island to rob the house. Wagner fled to Boston by train and was captured there the next day. He was tried for the double murder, convicted on circumstantial evidence, and hanged in 1875. The story was covered extensively by the press and has been reported and sensationalized in books and magazines - and now on film - ever since. Wagner, who had no alibi, maintained his innocence to the end.

Now I did wonder if her being from Norway and speaking poor English, would affect statement analysis.

MARINS: Testimony

My full name Mary S. Hontvent, am the wife of John C, Hontvent; was sister to Karen Christensen. Evan Christensen is my brother.

Question: How long before this matter at SmuttyNose did you live there.
Answer: Five years. I was at hom day before the murder.

Question: Was your husband there that day?
Answer: He left in the morning, about day-light with my brother, and his brother Matthew Hontvet, and Evan Christensen. Evan is husband of Anethe

Question: After he left that morning, when did you next see your husband?
Answer: I saw him the next morning after, cannot tell, but about ten o'clock.

Question: At nine o'clock that night, who were present at your house before you went to bed.
Answer: I, Karen, and Anethe. There were no other persons upon that island at the time.

Question: What time did you go to bed that night.
Answer: Ten o'clock. I slept in the western part of the house in the bed-room I, and Anethe slept together that night.

Shelley said...

Question: About ten o'clock you went to bed.
Answer: About ten. Karen staid there that night; she slept on a lounge in the kitchen. The lounge upon which Karen slept was in the easterly corner of the kitchen, corner standing up that way, and my bed-room that way. (Witness illustrates.)

Question: How was the door between the kitchen and the bed-room left, when you retired that night.
Answer: Left open.

Question: How were the curtains?
Answer: I did not haul them down, it was a pleasant night, so I left them open.

Question: I speak now of the curtains to the kitchen.
Answer: Yes.

Question: How the outside door to that part of the house, fastened or not?
Answer: No sir, they were not fastened. The lock was broke for some time, broke last summer and we did not fix it, it was unfastened. Karen was undressed, bed made; we made a bed up.

Question: Was there a clock in that room?
Answer: Yes, clock standing right over the lounge in the corner.

Question: If you were disturbed that night or awoke, state the first thing that awoke you, as far as you know, what took place.
Answer: Karen halooed, (Objected)

Question: State the first thing you heard.
Tapley for Defendant: I may as well interpose objection now to the declaration of Karen, or even the declaration of Anethe.
Court: I think it is a part of the res gestae.
Tapley: We raise the point in season to save that.

Question: Go on.
Answer: "John scared me, John scared me." She says.

Question: Are you able to determine in any way about what time during the night that was.
Answer: He woke up; I know about his going and striking her with a chair.

Question: About what time was it?
Answer: The clock was fallen down in the lounge, and stopped at seven minutes past one.

Question: After you heard Karen cry out, John scared me, what next took place?
Answer: John killed me, John killed me, she halooed out a good many times. When he commenced striking her with a chair she halooed out, John killed me, John killed me.

Question: What did you do?
Answer: As soon as I heard her haloo out, John killed me, I jumped up out of bed, and tried to open my bed- room door. I tried to get it open but could not, it was fastened.

Question: Go on.
Answer: He kept on striking her there, and I tried to get the door open, but I could not, the door was fastened. She fell down on the floor underneath the table, then the door was left open for me to go in.

Question: What next?
Answer: When I got the door open I looked out and saw a fellow standing right alongside of the window. I saw it was a great tall man. He grabbed a chair with both hands, a chair standing alongside of him. I hurried up to take Karen, my sister, and held one hand to the door. and took her with my other arm, and carried her as quick as I could. When I was standing there , he struck me twice , and I held on to the door. I told my sister Karen to hold on to the door, when I opened the window and we were trying to get out.

Question: Which window was that?
Answer: My Bed-room window, and she said no, I can't do it, I am so tired. She laid on the floor with her knees, and hanging her arms upon the bed. I told Anethe to come up and open the window, and to run out and take some clothes on her, to run and hide herself away.

Question: Where was Anethe when you told her that?
Answer: In my bed-room.

Question: Well.
Answer: She opened the window.

Question: Who opened the window.
Answer: Anethe opened the window, and left the window open and run out. I told her to run out.

Question: Where did she run out?
Answer: Out of the window, jumped out of the window.

Question: Go on.
Answer: I told her to run, and she said I can't run. I said you haloo, might somebody hear from the other island. She said, I cannot haloo. When I was standing there at the door, he was trying to get in three times, knocked at the door three times when I was standing at the door.



Shelley said...

Question: What door?
Answer: My bed-room door. When he found he could not get in that way, he went outside, and Anethe saw him on the corner of the house. She next halooed, Louis, Louis, Louis, a good many times, and I jumped to the window and looked out, and when he got a little further I saw him out at the window, and he stopped a moment out there,

Question: How far from the window was he when he stopped?
Answer: He was not far from the window; and he could have laid his elbow right that way on the window. (Witness illustrates)

Question: Who was that man?
Answer: Louis Wagner.

Question: Go on, what else took place?
Answer: And he turned around again, and when Anethe saw him coming from the corner of the house, back again with a big axe, she halooed out, Louis Louis, again, good many times she halooed out, Louis, till he struck her. He struck her with a great big axe.

Question: Did you see what part of her person the blow took effect?
Answer: He hit her on the head. He struck her once, and she fell down. After she fell down he struck her twice.

Question: Well.
Answer: And back he went on the corner again, and I jumped out, and told my sister to come, but she said, I am so tired I can't go.

Question: Which sister was that?
Answer: Karen. I told Karen to come; she said, I am so tired I can't.

Question: You jumped out where?
Answer: Out through may bed-room window, and I ran down to the hen-house where I had my hens, and opened the door and thought of hiding away in the cellar. I saw the little dog coming, and I was afraid to hide away there because he would look around, and I was afraid to the dog would bark, and out I went again. I thought I would run down to the landing-place and see if he had his dory there, and I would take the dory and draw to some island. I looked down the dock, but I did not find any boat there, so I went around. I got a little ways out from the house and I saw he had a light in the house.

Question: Go on, and state what you saw or heard.
Answer: He had hauled the window curtains down too. I did not haul them down, but he had them hauled down before I got into the kitchen. I forgot to state that. I went down on the island, ran a little ways, and heard my sister haloo again. I heard her so plain I thought she was outside of the house. I ran to find rocks to hid myself away underneath the rocks on the island.

Question: How long did you remain there among the rocks?
Answer: The moon was most down, and I staid till after sunrise, about half an hour after sunrise.

Question: Had you an axe on the island?
Answer: Yes, I had that axe few days before, cutting ice in the well, and I left the axe right out by my door, standing up alongside of the door. I had known Wagner for a year and a half, about. He boarded seven months with me last summer; came last spring.

Question: When did he leave, get through boarding with you?
Answer: He went into Portsmouth about November.

Question: What room did he occupy at your house?
Answer: He had the easterly end of the house, he had a big room there.

Question: Where did he keep his cloths?
Answer: He kept his cloths in a little bed-room there hanging up. He had oil skin hanging up in my entry, when he had been out fishing, he took his oil skin off and hung it up in the entry, entry coming into my kitchen.

Question: Entry in your part?
Answer: Yes.

Question: From what room in your part did stairs go up chamber?
Answer: We go right in the entry, and go right up-stairs. When he was going out, and took his old pants off, he used to open the entry door, and only two steps up-stairs, and hung his oil pants and oil jacket on the wall.

Question: What was in the kitchen which he occupied as his room?
Answer: He had his bed there, and one big trunk, which belonged to my sister Karen.

Shelley said...

Question: Do you know what was in that trunk?
Answer: She had cloths, some she wore in the winter time, and she put them in the trunk in the summer, and summer cloths she did not use she put in the trunk, and she had a feather-bed that she had at the time she came over in the steamer.

Question: Was that in the trunk?
Answer: Yes, the bed was in the trunk, the big chest.

Question: While he boarded with you, was Karen a member of your family?
Answer: She came out visiting me some days.

Question: Did she sleep there?
Answer: No sir.

Question: While he was there, was that lounge occupied as a sleeping place?
Answer: No sir, there was not anybody slept on the lounge.

Question: Do you know whether Karen had a piece of silver money?
Answer: Yes, she had that. I saw that, I cannot tell, October or or November, somewheres between there. The silver was a halfdollar piece. She got that from boarders at Hog Island. She said that to me. Objected

Question: Where did she keep that half-dollar?
Answer: In her purse.

Question: When did you see that purse last, before she was killed?
Answer: I saw that purse that afternoon.

Question: What else, if anything, was there in that purse that afternoon? (Objected)

Court: What else did you see?

Question: That is what I asked her. What did you see in that purse that afternoon?
Answer: She had money in there.

Question: What kind?
Answer: She had lots of copper money, and I gave her ten cents to buy me braid. She was going into Portsmouth, and Anethe gave her three-quarters of dollars, and she said. (Objected)

Question: Beside the money, did you see her put anything else in her pocket-book that afternoon?
Answer: Yes.

Question: What was it?
Answer: A button, white button-like.

Question: Have you any articles of clothing, with similar buttons upon it?
Answer: Yes, have got some.

Question: Where was the button taken from, if you know?
Answer: From my sewing basket.

Question: State what was done with the button, how did it come there?
Answer: She wanted a button. I was sitting down to sew at the table, and she wanted a button and asked me. (Obj.)

Question: Not that, what you did.
Answer: She took the sewing basket and looked for a button, and took a button there and handed it to Karen.

Question: Who took it from the basket?
Answer: Anethe, and handed it to Karen, and Karen put it in her purse.

Question: Have you any buttons similar to that?
Answer: Yes, have them with me. (At the request of County Attorney, witness produces buttons).

Question: Where did you get these buttons?
Answer: Got them in my sewing basket, found one in the basket and two in my box that I have always kept in my sewing basket. I have a night dress with similar buttons upon it. (Witness produces night dress.) On this night dress are six buttons of this white kind and one odd one. Karen had some small pieces of silver, cannot tell what they were, she had them in her hand, they were about the size of a five cent piece. I have in my hands Karen's travelling bag. That night it was left on table along beside the lounge. Karen took her purse down and fixed some things and put them into the bag to carry with her when she was to go to Portsmouth. I never have been onto the island since. I first saw the bag about a forthnight or three weeks after this occurrence; the lock was broken then.

Shelley said...

Yeaton for State: We offer both the night dress and the buttons produced here; (Obj.)

Court. I do not perceive at present, how they are connected with the matter sufficiently to admit them.

Yeaton: We will connect them hereafter and offer them again.

Question by Court. What relation are you to Anethe and Karen?

Answer: Anethen married my brother, and Karen was my own sister. Anethe's whole name was Anethe Christensen: she had no middle name.
Cross-examination by Mr. Tapley.

Question: Where in that room was this man standing when you first saw him?
Answer: Right by the window, next outside the door; cannot tell the dress he had on, had short clothes on, can give no other description of the dress he had on; saw him in that room once; did not see the man when he struck me. I had my back towards him. I saw he grabbed a chair. When I saw the man out of doors, cannot tell the color of the short cloths he had on. He had a hat on his head, some kind of dark hat, short hat with a wide rim; did not see his face.

Question: How long was he in your sight, when you were looking out of the window?
Answer: He was stopping a moment outside of the window. And then went away.

Question: You spoke nothing to the man?
Answer: No , sir.

Sick said...

OT

AUNT CARES MORE ABOUT FOOD STAMPS THAN THE LOSS OF HER THREE YEAR OLD NEWPHEW WHO DIES IN A FIRE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2u1Uyju8BA

The aunt who left the house with the mother says she has no regrets about leaving the children alone. (Ages 2 and 3)

"Nope. I really don't"

"I really need to get in there and see if my purse burned up. It has my food stamp card and everything in there."

Sick said...

The last part was said with a grin.

Anonymous said...

I thought this was all supposed to be concerning Hailey Dunn and justice for her!!!Not alll of the ones that was talked about its like all the other times, it goes into bringing other cases that dont even reference to Haileys case. I'm like everyone else SA and BD WILL GET AWAY WITH murder they commited

dadgum said...

You are appreciated, mystery moderator!

Anonymous said...

Shelley- do you have a link to where you got transcript? Or even better, Louis Wagner's testimony? This is interesting. I see some flags in her testimony, but read elsewhere that Louis' own testimony did him in.

Buckley

Local anon said...

Unfortunately that is one of the frustrating things about this blog. Lots of OT posts. It is just the way it is.

Shelley said...

Here you go Buckley

I can not find Louis's transcripts. I have looked but I only have been able to find the "he said" stuff and not his direct comments.

http://www.seacoastnh.com/smuttynose/history.html

~mj said...

Shelley, very intriguing indeed.

While her testimony does raise question, I did a little research and if you take her testimony in perspective of the events it makes more sense. I understand that doesnt go with the whole "statement is alive" thing, but hey. Plus her broken English certainly makes it harder for her testimony to flow. I also read that the testimony was trancribed with error, so that doesn't help either.

It is quite compelling though that Mr. Wagner did not have an alibi - with something like a staggering 11 hrs unaccounted for, was broke the day before the murders but was able to afford a train ticket, a shave, and new clothes the following day. A bloody (tested positive for human blood) shirt was located hidden in the privvy near where he was boarding and he was found with a button matching that of Maren's that she had given to her sister in his pocket.

I love a good mystery as well as the next gal, and this one was well worth my time to look further into it. Thanks!

Anonymous said...

She is sensitive about identifying him visually. Perhaps she didn't ID him herself but is going on the witness haloos, though with three if them, that could be made up as well.

I also wonder if she exaggerated how much she was able to help the other two.

Buckley